Author Topic: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon  (Read 7748 times)

Mexecutioner

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #30 on: February 13, 2020, 00:35:14 »
Interestingly the price of the D6 in the USA is almost the same as what Nikon charged for the D5 when it was first released four years ago.

My D5 is still in tip-top condition after four years of extensive use (I use it for everything and everywhere) so I have no reason to even be reading the specs. of the D6 but yet . . . .

Perhaps D5 would like a younger brother?

You know you want it... Your D5 wants a sibling too...  What to do....

Ann

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #31 on: February 13, 2020, 06:18:32 »
A D6 is a huge temptation — although I really have no way of justifying the purchase of a new camera right now!

:)


chambeshi

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #32 on: February 13, 2020, 08:18:23 »
In an interview (published 12th Feb) this Nikon Executive confirms Nikon responded to feedback from D5 shooters, and it appears they ranked their top needs as: Better AF, Seamless Wireless, improved options to Customize Menus.

In contrast, requests Video, Lv etc didn't feature much, if at all, and it appears neither did a higher resolution sensor. With the very best AFC, the key features that matter for shooting sports are better performance in low light with fastest shutter speeds etc.

https://www.dpreview.com/interviews/6739481235/ces-2020-interview-nikon-we-are-at-a-transitional-stage

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Frank Fremerey

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #33 on: February 13, 2020, 14:37:09 »
A D6 is a huge temptation — although I really have no way of justifying the purchase of a new camera right now!

:)



You can afford. You want. You buy. That is Ann.
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Ann

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #34 on: February 13, 2020, 17:29:25 »
There wouldn't be much demand for more pixels from the kind of photographers who buy these fast-action sports cameras.
 They use long focal-length lenses to fill the frame; and a 20+ sensor is more than sufficient for their needs in most cases. They also may need to instantly transmit images quickly across the Internet.

Publications and Web Sites only require relatively small images

I have never understood the race for larger and larger pixel counts.
 
How many photographs larger than 20" x 16" are the complainers going to actually print?
Also, consider the normal viewing-distance for anything larger than that.

Ilkka Nissilä

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #35 on: February 13, 2020, 19:13:15 »
It depends on the photographer and situation.

Nikon did make the D850 as they had received requests for the combination of high speed and high resolution. And it's a very popular camera.

Saying that the action photographer always has just the right length of long lens so that no cropping is needed doesn't seem always realistic. I photograph figure skating quite often and in that sport, the subject to camera distance can vary greatly. I have seen photographers do long rapid fire sequences of athletes approaching from quite a distance and I know from looking at the lenses used that for most of the sequence they would not have been filling the frame or even close. However, then I also see photographers do single shots at carefully planned moments in the performance. They go to rehearsals and find out the best angles for specific moments.

But there can also be unpredictable moments. And the lens on camera may not be the best one. IMO the D850 gives some additional playroom in such situations and preserves quality better when the image needs to be cropped. Maybe the tonal and color quality of the D5 in indoor sports is better (ISO would be in that camera's most competitive range) but still the D850 images are a bit sharper and more crisp. Of course whether this is needed is another question but it's evident in a moderate sized print. Of course, a frame-filling shot is better than a cropped one. But still, sometimes I enjoy shooting with the 70-200/2.8 like it were a 70-300mm f/2.8-4 in terms of outcome. And tracking and keeping an unpredictably moving subject in the frame is easier when I can keep a bit of extra room around the subject in the viewfinder and yet still keep enough pixels in the final composition.

However, at the end of the day I have to admit that if I can get a first-row seat, I usually shoot with the D5 and 200/2 and like the frame-filling images the best. So I guess this is just a long-winded admission of agreement.  :)

MFloyd

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #36 on: February 13, 2020, 20:45:17 »
My first D5 dates from March 2016, the other one from June 2017. I will keep the younger one. And I pre-ordered a D6 this morning, hoping to have it by end April.

An even better AF, and a WiFi / Bluetooth / SnapBridge communication interface, was on the top of my wish list. I never use the video features of these cameras. And LifeView is almost limited to still subjects.
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Mexecutioner

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #37 on: February 13, 2020, 20:53:36 »
There wouldn't be much demand for more pixels from the kind of photographers who buy these fast-action sports cameras.
 They use long focal-length lenses to fill the frame; and a 20+ sensor is more than sufficient for their needs in most cases. They also may need to instantly transmit images quickly across the Internet.

Publications and Web Sites only require relatively small images

I have never understood the race for larger and larger pixel counts.
 
How many photographs larger than 20" x 16" are the complainers going to actually print?
Also, consider the normal viewing-distance for anything larger than that.

I totally hear what you say and for most applications in my case 20-24MP works and the files are a nice manageable size. Last October I got an IQ4150 back and the 150MP files are breathtaking to say the least and every time I see them up on the computer I shake my head in disbelief, but that of course has to do more with other aspects than resolution alone. I haven't printed anything yet but I am tempted to do some really large scale prints, the thing is I don't have enough wall space at home to display them.

Hugh_3170

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2020, 01:41:38 »
If I recall correctly, ISO400 35mm/135 format colour print film was the equivalent to about 6MP before increasing the level digitisation started to fail to yield more useful definition. 

Correctly exposed slide film and fine grain B&W did better than this.  However few 35mm films for this format would do much better than 20MP even in the best of circumstances and handling.  Moreover, scanners such as Nikon's well regarded Coolscan series rarely delivered above 4,000DPI (about 20MP after cropping around the slide mount).

So with a good quality 20MP sensor in the FX/135 format, peoples cameras have already film behind, especially when the correct viewing distance in respect to the size of the print is observed. 

I do concede that a larger sensor resolution is helpful if framing is loose and cropping is required, but FX/135 format cameras with about 20 to 24MP seem to be in vogue and with good reason for general purpose photography.
Hugh Gunn

Erik Lund

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2020, 08:18:50 »
It's very obvious to me that a lot of us really like/use the really high resolution of the D850 and Z7 that doesn't mean the D6 is bad, the D6 is just capable of different things, optimized for other or additional functions  ;D 8)
High resolution makes eyes pop and architecture stand out, and yes for large prints!
Matt Granger, a long time Nikon aficionado is not impressed with the D6 on announcement, dissing it to pieces even before starting to use it  ::)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQ2DZhDuTek

Seems to me some have a very difficult time understanding there is  huge difference between; Need to have and nice to have,,, must own and!
It's completely fine with me if you just like the best and greatest and never print, fine I know this feeling ;) but it's like not really the target the Nikon designers go for, they go for optimized for the particular job, the intended purpose for that camera, if you're not shooting with the camera with that intent, don't expect the tool, camera is perfect for your intensions or use.Matt is comparing the D6 to some small cameras, I would newer dream of taking such cameras to a paid sports or PJ event type shooting jobs,,, I also think his mirroless arguments a flawed as I see it, there is still a long way before they are up to DSLR viewing experience if they ever get that  ::)
Erik Lund

chambeshi

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2020, 08:53:42 »
The troll armies have swarmed over trashing the D6. Typing away past their bedtimes. The cellphone is the limit of most keyboard eggspurts, judging by the silliness and worse.

Many enthusiasts and also Pros do not need a D6, but we all be using the D6 AFC engine if we upgrade to future cameras. Brad Hill and Thom Hogan published some measured pre-use comments on the D6. Otherwise we wait weeks into April - and longer - for reliable reviews. Utubers are best ignored.
http://www.naturalart.ca/voice/blog.html#D6PrelimThoughts

- D6 AF focusing system, ENEL18c, ~12 fps, dual CFexpress, What is needed rather urgently (if Nikon want upgraders and new owners of DSLRs) is a D850 with emboldened specifications, including cloning feratures across from the D6 and also Z7/D780.

Many owners of this D880 will shoot macro, so ISO64 is mandatory, as is tilting touch screen, and more than decent Lv AFS etc (focus-peaking). Such a camera will also continue to appeal to landscape shooters. So adding key features that have just been added into the D780 will clinch appeal across genres. An improved  Z7 sensor that does noticeably better - ie less noise - IQ at ISO6400. The D850 has its traction through fitting the individual demands across a diversity of genres. As Jeff McNally and Dixey Dixon quipped at its launch in NYC - The camera of totality



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Frank Fremerey

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2020, 09:08:46 »
recap: not much innovation following the wishes of a small user base. Great upgrade for D3s/D4s users who skipped the D5
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MILLIREHM

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2020, 09:28:22 »
To me the D6 appears to be a D5S - a D5S I have liked to buy some 2 years ago
If the AF System proves to be a significant improvement I will buy a D6 (as I dont have to justify anything). With dozens of F-mount lenses including Superteles I am "captured" in the system (which i still consider to be the best choice for me). So sure lots of Nikon D4/D4s/D5- users will upgrade sooner or later. (BTW i am satisfied with the resolution, there is the D850 out there as well for these kinds of jobs).

Photo industry is not only serving needs but beefing up their products with features creating dreams and illusion.
In this aspect the impression is inevitable that former pro-level leader nikon is not on par with Canon any more, which will further (may it be on an irrational level) influence decisions in which system to buy in (or some even to change as it already happened in the past). This might contribute to NIkon having a harder time in sales than it already has now - which is unfavorable. These type of cameras are designed for SPorts photographers  and action- nature photographers profit
My favorite Nature Photographers magazine shows an increasing Share of Canon shots observable throughout the last months and years- dont expect D6 to be a trend changer
Wolfgang Rehm

Wannabebetter

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #43 on: February 14, 2020, 09:45:36 »
I am confident the D6 will have its place in all manner of hell, be it the US House of Representatives or some far-flung field of misery and slaughter, for years to come.

Ilkka Nissilä

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Re: Nikon D6 formally announced by Nikon
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2020, 13:28:48 »
To me the D6 appears to be a D5S - a D5S I have liked to buy some 2 years ago

Well, it is not common that Nikon develops a whole new state-of-the-art AF module every two years (the previous genuinely new module before the D5 in 2016 was from the 2007 D3, tweak a couple times over 13 years, then the D5 gets a genuinely new one and the D6 four years later again gets a new module). Since Nikon's Kenji Oishi says the AF system of the D6 is a "dramatic jump" from the D5, I am willing to give them the benefit of doubt and assume that indeed it is a significant improvement. I'm surprised that people aren't more excited about it, I think pretty much nobody expected a new module and it wasn't mentioned in the rumors.

Quote
Photo industry is not only serving needs but beefing up their products with features creating dreams and illusion.

Yes, sure, but in the end the performance and results are what matter, not imaginary things.

Quote
In this aspect the impression is inevitable that former pro-level leader nikon is not on par with Canon any more

I thought that Canon took over in early 1990s and has pretty much held onto that position, so this isn't really new! At sports events I always see many more Canons than other brands.

As for what Canon did in the 1DX III what they produced is a new AF system for the viewfinder photography (as did Nikon) but without evaluating its performance, it's difficult to know if either of them is ahead.

Canon also put in a lot of video features into the 1DX III, but I don't know if it is sensible to use this type of a brick for video unless as a second or third camera. There is no viewfinder for video and the camera is heavy. Nikon put video feature upgrades into the Z6, Z7, D780 and D850, less so in the D6. I think the lighter bodies such as Z6 make more sense for video work since there is a viewfinder that can be used, there is no extra mass of optical viewfinder components that cannot be used in video, and so handling should be much easier on rigs that can be lighter weight. I just don't see why video features would be so crucial in a D6 type camera. Apart from  video features, what "dreams" did Canon invoke?

To me Canon have a comprehensive DSLR lens system which is their main strength. Canon's fast superteles are lighter than Nikon's. On the other hand Nikon have the 500 PF which arguably wins the lightness contest easily. However, in mirrorless Canon have a scattered approach with separate APS-C and FF mounts and the APS-C system has only a small number of lenses and primes are mainly around normal and moderate wide angle focal lengths. The FF mirrorless system has a lot of exotics (f/1.2 primes and f/2.0 zoom) and only two sub-1000€ lenses. I thought mirrorless was about getting a lighter weight but high quality system; how do RF system users compile a light weight setup? Nikon have 14-30/4 and 24-70/4, both getting excellent reviews and compact. They have a set of 5 new f/1.8 primes all again so far reviewed favourably. To me this is a much more sensible approach to mirrorless. But somehow the market likes Canon. It's as if they only sell a dream, not what is really needed, and the customers take it and swallow greedily. (Canon did produce a set of f/2.8 zooms and that's probably what many users will buy. But we can't really talk about a compact setup in such a case. The 70-200/2.8 is compact for its specification but loses some focal length upon close focus so it's kind of what you see is what you get.)

I like the Canon R5 button and control layout from the back of the camera, it seems they put in all the controls that are needed (wheras the main control wheel is missing from the R). However, it is difficult for me to believe it would be affordable. Yes, dreams, but does the reality match up?

For example, what I would like to do with mirrorless is photograph people quietly with a smaller, less obtrusive camera setup and quieter shutter. Right now the electronic shutter comes with some drawbacks but the mechanical shutter of a mirrorless camera still feels quieter than the combination of mechanical shutter and mirror movement. The Z7's sound is quite pleasant in my opinion. So with it I could photograph people with less attention being directed to me than when using a DSLR (though the D810, for example, and many DX models such as D7200 are quite quiet also, and the quiet continuous mode can be useful).

In these situations where I want to photograph people at close distance, aside from quiet operation, I need a lens aperture that is large enough that I can get high-quality images. I would say f/1.4 and f/1.8 both qualify when used with modern FX sensors. An f/1.2 is unnecessarily large and I consider it more a special-effect lens. For this type of photography, I might want to use 20/1.8, 35/1.8, 50/1.8 and 85/1.8. Nikon already offers such a set costing about 3500€ (less if timed for rebates). If I wanted to get four primes from Canon, I could not build an equivalent set and if I wanted native primes, I'd be spending many times more for f/1.2 lenses that are not best suited for photographing without drawing attention to me.