Author Topic: The new Nikon mirrorless system  (Read 147676 times)

MILLIREHM

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #360 on: September 11, 2018, 11:10:42 »
Akira posted a japanese link to a Nikon prototype exhibition
http://nikongear.net/revival/index.php/topic,7834.msg127153/topicseen.html#msg127153
Thanks Akira

This lead me to another link which appears to be specs including a compatibility Chart  for the FTZ adapter
http://www.nikon-image.com/products/accessory/body/ftz/spec.html

Given my non existent japanese skills it appears to contain also a list of incompatible Nikon F-lenses below
The 21 cm Nikkor is also listed here (update unfortunately the 10 mm OP fisheye as well)
Wolfgang Rehm

Seapy

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #361 on: September 11, 2018, 11:12:03 »
The large Z mount also makes it possible to create tilt/shift lenses with greater range of movements than before.

Will this be an opportunity for the Cambo Actus to capitalise on new, more suitable hardware?  Will the protruding grip get in the way?
Robert C. P.
South Cumbria, UK

Erik Lund

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #362 on: September 11, 2018, 11:12:59 »
Akira posted a japanese link to a Nikon prototype exhibition
http://nikongear.net/revival/index.php/topic,7834.msg127153/topicseen.html#msg127153
Thanks Akira

This lead me to another link which appears to be specs including a compatibility Chart  for the FTZ adapter
http://www.nikon-image.com/products/accessory/body/ftz/spec.html

Given my non existent japanese skills it appears to contain also a list of incompatible Nikon F-lenses below
The 21 cm Nikkor is also listed here (fortunately the 10 mm OP fisheye is not included)


The site is there in English as well, lots of info ;)


https://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-products/camera-lenses/dslr-lenses/index.page
Erik Lund

Seapy

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #363 on: September 11, 2018, 11:15:11 »
For all the reasons you mentioned above it will not send the light rays straight onto the sensor so it's 'not suitable' in Nikonsk

Thank you Erik, each day I learn something new!  ;D
Robert C. P.
South Cumbria, UK

MILLIREHM

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #364 on: September 11, 2018, 11:24:04 »

The site is there in English as well, lots of info ;)


https://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-products/camera-lenses/dslr-lenses/index.page

Thanks Erik
Just found out and wanted to update the link
https://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/accessory/camera/ftz/spec.htm

it lists all non- AI lenses as incompatible which is hard to believe as there is no AI coupling lever
Wolfgang Rehm

Erik Lund

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #365 on: September 11, 2018, 11:31:48 »
Will this be an opportunity for the Cambo Actus to capitalise on new, more suitable hardware?  Will the protruding grip get in the way?
Seems like they have kept good distance to grip and trigger area on the Z so potential is definitely there,,,


It's just more movement requires more coverage and it in turn requires more glass, i believe.
Erik Lund

Seapy

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #366 on: September 11, 2018, 11:52:41 »
It lists all non- AI lenses as incompatible which is hard to believe as there is no AI coupling lever

Perhaps "incompatible" doesn't mean unusable, like some of the limitations with the F mount?  Maybe it just means unsuitable, as in loss of image quality due the the reasons Roland outlined?
Robert C. P.
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Erik Lund

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #367 on: September 11, 2018, 11:59:05 »
Perhaps "incompatible" doesn't mean unusable, like some of the limitations with the F mount?  Maybe it just means unsuitable, as in loss of image quality due the the reasons Roland outlined?


Please read this warning from B on the 21mm f/4 Nikkor O:
Oh dear.NEVER EVER THINK OF MOUNTING THE 21/4 NIKKOR-Oon any camera except Nikon F, F2, or late NikkormatsIt will mount on a mirrorless model through the appropriate adapter, however, performance is quite poor.


http://nikongear.net/revival/index.php/topic,5290.msg83795.html#msg83795
Erik Lund

Ilkka Nissilä

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #368 on: September 11, 2018, 12:01:58 »
Completely correct both of you, but is it really so that this is a big problem now? Don't we already have affordable glass that deliver the amazing image quality and we can with a quick raw conversion tinker what we need in PP,,,

For the 50mm f/1.8 S, it does have notably higher MTF than the current F mount AF-S version. There are high quality 50mm's such as the Otus and the Sigma but they are huge and heavy. I think the new 50mm f/1.8 seems to strike a good balance between weight and image quality. If the vignetting is also low then it could also be used for indoor available light images with an advantage over current f/1.8 lenses. The 58/1.4 AF-S has low vignetting but particularly soft corners. With the new mount I would expect such compromises could be avoided. Also on the Canon side their new 50/1.2 R seems to be significantly sharper than their EF mount version. I am not saying that this is all about the new mount, could be simply that they are made to a higher standard, but they haven't done that with the DSLR 50mm lenses that they produce.

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The situation is that we all have tons of legacy glass,,,

Quite right, I am quite happy with my existing Nikon (and third party) lenses for the F mount but a couple of exceptions only.

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Other mounts have emerged and died out quite quickly,,, I fear the Z could face the same unless the lenses really are spectacular and relatively affordable.

I think the first three lenses seem quite competitively priced given the image quality (though obviously the image quality needs to be assessed in practical use). The Noct is another situation but if Nikon bring out both a 50/1.8 and 50/1.2, then most people won't need to consider the Noct.

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If they are as I fear, with various defects lateral chromatic fringing as some already report and f/1.8 I'm just raising my concern for selling off my F's and replace then with inferior Z's,,,

Lateral CA can be corrected in software and thus it can be seen as an easier-to-forgive error than, e.g., longitudinal CA (which can also be corrected in some way but at least the algorithms that I've tried have been very slow).

I doubt the new Z lenses will be inferior. It's just as the sharpness increases, it is easier to see CA if uncorrected (since other aberrations are so well corrected).  I also don't think it has been Nikon's aim to make apocromatic lenses; what they seem to go for is a "pleasing overall look", though there are exceptions. The trend is now towards the greatest sharpness and somehow Sigma got ahead of Nikon in this when the 36MP cameras came out Nikon seemed to be a bit unprepared, and only more recently have been putting out lenses that take greater advantage of the high-resolution models.

Although I think Nikon lenses yield beautiful results I think they really need to work on the perceived value in the eyes of a typical customer aspect.

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The pro sport shooters, birders etc. will not like sluggish or unpredictable AF so it seems we will have a very long grace period or transition to Z, if too slow it will die out,,, Sure they keep the DSLR and F-mount - Rally vice decision as a fall back! IMHO

I think it's not necessary for the system to be the best for sports or bird in flight photography; it can exist as a portrait, wedding, event, travel, landscape, video system parallel to the DSLRs. I think only a small percentage of photographers get into telephoto action due to the costs involved (not to mention heavy gear as well) and a system doesn't need to be the best at everything to find customers.

I don't think the Z system will fail. If it does, then Nikon may fail as well, since the constant drummaging by websites that make money from switchers and buyers of the latest gear has imposed on people's minds that "mirrorless is the future" (and the only future). I personally find that it is great that there is a diversity of different technologies available and prefer the DSLR for my use but sometimes this kind of waves of consumer buying trends take over and investors can make decisions that affect us in adverse ways. Also there are so many posters online who cannot tolerate diversity and want to impose the same type of camera on everyone. This is something I really dislike. Let people decide for themselves.

One advantage that the large diameter mount may be more stable when used with adapter and existing F mount lenses. The larger diameter means the forces on the mount (from a lens that is acted upon by gravity to twist the camera mount) should be a bit smaller.

Erik Lund

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #369 on: September 11, 2018, 13:28:03 »
Thanks Ilkka, your right on all accounts  :)
Erik Lund

Birna Rørslett

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #370 on: September 11, 2018, 13:45:35 »
The perceived extra stability of the new wide Z-mount with 4 claws is very obvious.   

MILLIREHM

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #371 on: September 11, 2018, 14:32:06 »
The perceived extra stability of the new wide Z-mount with 4 claws is very obvious.

Agreed. And requires less movement angle to mount/unmount the lens, wich is comfortable. The downside is, that it unmounts itself easier when the unlock button is activated accidentially (Had a D700 coming off my 200-400 Supertele this way, when i was grabbing just the lens - fortunately the mounted MB-D10 prevented damage.
Wolfgang Rehm

Eddie Draaisma

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #372 on: September 11, 2018, 17:46:12 »
Dpreview has some Nikon Z7 raw files available for download; these just open in the latest version of ACR. The night shots with the 35/1.8S full open look very very very promising.

Birna Rørslett

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #373 on: September 11, 2018, 17:55:14 »
Good on me I have the 35/1.8S on order, then :D I was pretty impressed by its optical quality when I tried it in London some weeks ago. Not equally sure about the lens design and handling as such, but only field use will clarify these aspects.

Eddie Draaisma

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Re: The new Nikon mirrorless system
« Reply #374 on: September 11, 2018, 20:53:41 »
Birna, hopefully it handles reasonably well too.

ACR mentions that it uses the built-in lens profile of the 35/1.8S; for the 35/1.8S it means that in ACR both distortion and vignetting cannot be changed (on the lens corrections tab).

The latest PhotoNinja also is able to open these Z7 raw files; assuming that PN does not use any built-in profile for distortion it seems to me that the geometrical distortion of the 35/1.8S is rather low. It might mean that ACR does not do any distortion correction for this lens at all.