Making a Panorama Head with a Difference.

[Akira]

Robert, thank you for the very detailed explanation.  That makes lots of sense now.

I would have to confess that I had thought that you would be using the arc horizontally, which would makes no sense for the pano.  But when you use it vertically, that is an excellent idea!   

[Seapy]

Thank you Akira, It's a different approach and no doubt there will be room for refinement but if it works as expected I will be happy.

The main unknown for me is how a conventional nodal rail (designed to fit a straight mount) will take to being installed on a curved mounting rail.  It will mean there will be three distinct points of contact, which could be good but not sure if the jaws will open far enough to allow for that.  This is where a good CAD software would help out.  It will only need a little fettling so no real worries.

[Øivind Tøien]

...  This is where a good CAD software would help out. ....

Commercial 3D CAD licences are really expensive, but there is open source FreeCad, https://www.freecadweb.org/ which is quite capable, in very active development, and has a friendly support forum. If you check it out, do not let the version no. fool you, it should be multiplied with a factor of >10 (I am using the development version, 0.17 which is pretty stable).

This example of use might wet your appetite    :
https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=21683

[Seapy]

This example of use might wet your appetite    :
https://forum.freecadweb.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=21683

Thank you Øivind, I have downloaded the software, I have in fact looked at it before but gave up in despair because I couldn't make head nor tail of it.  However I am persevering and am watching many You-Tube tutorials.  It's slowly  beginning to make sense.  It's so tiny step by tiny step, compared with what I an used to that I couldn't understand it.  The principle is totally different from conventional CAD drawing software that I have used before.  I have drawn many plans and drawings of houses, factories and smaller developments over the years so I'm not without experience but this is totally different.

If I can master the software I shall be eternally grateful to you!  It's looking promising already.  Maybe a couple of days...

Robert

[rs]

This is where a good CAD software would help out.

Hi Robert,

Another CAD candidate you might try, if not already:

http://qcad.org/en/qcad-downloads-trial

You download the trial version and can remove the "Professional" addon to continue to use it without those features, although it is pretty good value. I've only used the Linux version and found it pretty capable.

Regards,

Richard

[Øivind Tøien]

Thank you Øivind, I have downloaded the software, I have in fact looked at it before but gave up in despair because I couldn't make head nor tail of it.  However I am persevering and am watching many You-Tube tutorials.  It's slowly  beginning to make sense.  It's so tiny step by tiny step, compared with what I an used to that I couldn't understand it.  The principle is totally different from conventional CAD drawing software that I have used before.  I have drawn many plans and drawings of houses, factories and smaller developments over the years so I'm not without experience but this is totally different.

If I can master the software I shall be eternally grateful to you!  It's looking promising already.  Maybe a couple of days...

Robert

I am glad if it can be of help for you. I had exactly the same feeling first time I looked at FreeCad; I could not figure out anything. But when I then came back to it later and spent the time (this kind if thing needs practice and experimentation - not only reading about it), I got above that first threshold and it started to be fun. I have kept mostly to the Sketcher and Part workbench, which is pretty well established (+ the Stepup workbench for cooperation with electronic design software); the Part Design is newer and less established and I have found it more tricky.  In ver. 0.17 there are very good tools to move parts around and rotate them. There are probably near infinite possibilities to keep learning a software like this, but one can get very far by just learning what one needs at the moment.

I am wary of the concept of limited versions of commercial software that is free; one never knows what a company might do down the path. A recent example is the electronic design software Eagle. I personally use open source KiCad, http://kicad-pcb.org/, never liked Eagle enough to learn it, and we have seen a number of Eagle users come over to KiCad lately after the free Eagle version became paid subscription software....

[rs]

I am wary of the concept of limited versions of commercial software that is free; one never knows what a company might do down the path.

I agree and one of the nice things about Qcad, is the author provides the limited version as Open Source as well, so there's nothing to stop anyone adding extra features.

Robert, one of the features available in the paid version of Qcad, that I've found the price worth many times over as a hobby cabinetmaker, is the ability to print parts out at 1:1 scale, across multiple sheets of A4 paper, along with registration marks. This means one can tape them all together, for cutting out templates, without needing A3 printers or plotters.

Regards,

Richard

[Øivind Tøien]

I see, and it is 2D CAD, so quite different from FreeCAD, rather complementary.  What is really nice about 3D CAD is that one can design multiple parts (or download STEP models if available) and then manipulate them in 3D space to see how they fit together before producing any hard copy or real thing at all. The software can then create files for CNC or 3D printing, or models can be sent to a commercial shop for production (although at a price...). Among open source 2D CAD I often see LibreCAD mentioned (http://librecad.org), although I have not had time to try it out yet.

[rs]

Among open source 2D CAD i often see LibreCAD mentioned (http://librecad.org), although I have not had time to try it out yet.

Yes, my understanding is that LibreCAD was a fork of the open source version 2 of Qcad. I haven't looked at it for some years now.

Regards,

Richard

[Seapy]

I took the advice to go out and make some photographs seriously and here is the result...



I also took the opportunity to persevere with my quest to master FreeCad.  About four days of intense banging my head against a brick wall and it's slowly beginning to make sense.  I can now create the shapes I want (well some of them!) and for the most part place them where I want to place them.  I have watched hours of YouTube tutorials about FreeCad, some make sense, others were a waste of ether space.  Two particular videos unlocked the software for for me, one in Italian, and the other with a robot dialogue!    And I don't speak Italian...

This is my first successful effort, it clearly shows the form of the curved Arca rail which will form the backbone of my Panorama head.



The outer dovetail cut is not quite right, too deep by a couple of mm or so but that's a detail, I will re-draw it once I have constructed the rest of the head.  I am currently struggling to form a hole on the base block at 90º to the current drawing axis but having read up some info and slept on it, I think I will master that today.  I almost had it last night but when I hit the cut button it all vanished from the screen!  LOL   

Good to be back, many thanks for the suggestions for CAD software.  The main reason I had avoided 3D was I found it very difficult to comprehend, not the 3D concept but the totally strange way in which the drawings and shapes are generated.  So excepting for some insurmountable obstacle I shall stick with FreeCAD for now at least.  It's slowly falling into place in my mind.  You are never too old to learn.  Learning opens up the future.

[Seapy]

Well, I now have comprehendible image of my Pano Head with a difference:

[David H. Hartman]

I have a couple more if you are interested showing the Greeves and a 250 Triumph which is awaiting restoration.  The Triumph has a 500cc speedway engine which runs on methanol.

By this series of photographs I can see you weren't Mods. Were you guys at the Battle of Brighton Beach?

Dave Hartman

[Seapy]

By this series of photographs I can see you weren't Mods. Were you guys at the Battle of Brighton Beach?

Dave Hartman

Rolling on the floor Laughing!   

[Øivind Tøien]

Well, I now have comprehendible image of my Pano Head with a difference:

Robert, I am really impressed by your progress with FreeCad after such a short time!! I think you are going to have a lot of fun with it. The comment on learning from a tutorial in Italian without knowing the language is right on. 3D CAD is really learned by doing, not so much by talking.

[Seapy]

Thanks Øivind,  It was a hard slog and very frustrating but I realised that this approach to 3D is on the whole probably the easiest route so I precivered.  I could have done it in a few minutes with the software I am used to but that's progress, soon I hope to be reasonably fluent with FreeCad then it will be a quick process also.  I am very grateful to you all for the encouragement to clear this hurdle.  I should have done it some time ago when I built the Kit Car.  It would have been invaluable for that.

The nodal plates I ordered have arrived now so as soon as I can turn the ring, I can proceed with the project.

I am considering if I can make the link bar that fits on top of the rotating base, clamp onto the curved sector plate instead of bolting it on.  That would guarantee the notional centre of the sector plate being aligned with the 'nodal point' of the lens and the assembly.  It would also simplify the construction and assembly.  This is where having it as a 3D CAD is good because I can look at it in all directions and consider the options.  Even try different parts.