APO (or near) Lenses in Nikon F-Mount

[Michael Erlewine]

Yep.

I will wind up getting the D850, probably by next spring, and I believe it will be my last camera purchase for a long time.

I believe the in-camera stacking will be of more benefit to landscape AF lenses than macro, at least at this stage.

Right now, the D810 still serves me well @ base ISO and I don't see the need to change at the moment.

I anticipate Nikon will be upgrading the old 200 Micro-Nikkor ... but who knows if it will be Apo or not. Hope so.

Cheers.

I believe the Sony A7R3 is a sleeper, meaning my guess (as far as I can tell) is that it will be very close to the performance of the D850 and (hopefully) offer the pixel-shift technnology which will equal MF images, albeit for still life only, which is all I do.

[JKoerner007]

I believe the Sony A7R3 is a sleeper, meaning my guess (as far as I can tell) is that it will be very close to the performance of the D850 and (hopefully) offer the pixel-shift technnology which will equal MF images, albeit for still life only, which is all I do.

I will be interested in your views/comparison.

Since most of what I do is wildlife shots, pixel-shift is not as important to me.

However, in-studio, I could see how this could make a subtle difference.

At this point, I think camera ISO/DR values are becoming more-and-more similar ... so purchase decisions are going to boil down to lens availability and what features compliment a photographer's style.

For me, the D850 will likely be the summit for many years to come.

[Michael Erlewine]

For me, the D850 will likely be the summit for many years to come.

I agree, but it looks like the low ISO on the D850 is noisier than that on the D810, but not enough for me to not use the D850. I understand why landscape and "bugs" may warrant using the new stacking feature of the D850, but for me on the D850, the silent mode with EFC (mirror up) is amazingly fast and should be looked at. I use it all the time now.

[JKoerner007]

I corresponded with Zeiss (a lens expert) for an Otus macro lens and his response was that they would have to sell 10,000 of them to consider making one. Ouch!

Honestly, with 7.6 billion people in the world, 10,000 customers is 1 out of every 760,000 people.

Easily doable ...

In fact, if an Otus macro lens were made, and were $4,000 or less, I would venture to say Zeiss would sell far more than 10,000 copies within a year ... for sure within 2 years.

[Michael Erlewine]

Honestly, with 7.6 billion people in the world, 10,000 customers is 1 out of every 760,000 people.

Easily doable ...

In fact, if an Otus macro lens were made, and were $4,000 or less, I would venture to say Zeiss would sell far more than 10,000 copies within a year ... for sure within 2 years.

You would think! But teaching these camera companies what we want is a thankless task.

I am happy to see that more attention is being paid to correctlng color in lenses, witness some of the Zeiss Milvus offerings.

[chambeshi]

Stumbled on this site searching for reviews of Sigma macro lenses

FYI' a couple of links relevant to APO optics

https://www.closeuphotography.com/voigtlander-apo-lanthar-125mm-lens/

https://www.closeuphotography.com/sigma-150mm-macro-lens/

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Interestingly, he tested the APO 125CV at 1:1, a range in which it performs only substandard.

[JKoerner007]

Interestingly, he tested the APO 125CV at 1:1, a range in which it performs only substandard.

Yep. I referenced the same test (re-posted on Photomacrography) on the previous page of this thread.

Also, even at 1:1, at its widest f/2.5 aperture, Ray Charles can see the CV is about twice as sharp as the Sigma is @ f/2.8.

While the test was for CA, the Sigma 150 f/2.8 shots are so blurred they don't even look to in focus ... while the sharpness of the CV is unmistakable.
Also, at the smaller apertures, every image he shot with the Sigma is back-focused on the lower part of the upper "O" ... while the CA is precisely center-focused ... because it can be done manually, not relying on AF.

With respect to his comments on the retro-grade chrome trim not being 'professional,' while subjective of course, I find this to be part of the CV's charm and "touch of class" ... while every single low-end, POS lens available today is a flat-black/plastic offering.

[Michael Erlewine]

When all is said and done, IMO, the CV-125 APO Lanthar is the best all-around lens for close-up work I know of. This may be sad and points out the need today for a really, really good macro lens for the Nikon mount. Nikon is, IMO, years behind offering one. And I do not understand why Voigtlander did not offer their new 65mm Macro in Nikon format. It has a lot in common with the CV-125. Or, for that matter, they could re-issue the CV-125.

I have the various Zeiss Otus series (and the 135mm that I consider Otus), and the Zeiss lenses are better corrected and sharper, but they are not meant for close-up work. When it comes right down to where the rubber meets the road, I can always reach for my CV-125.

There is a special quality to the CV-125, call it draw or style or whatever....anyway you want to spell it; the look of images shot with the CV-125 have a special quality. If we move to bellows-based work, then IMO the APO El Nikkor 105mm has the same speicial qualities and is even more useful (to me) than the CV-125. In my experience sheer "sharpness," correction, and so on without some special qualities, even if they are caused by defects (photographically) like the Nikkor "O" CRT lens, which may not be made for "white " light and it it is curved, etc. But its style is almost unique and very lovely.

I don't use the CV-125 for 1:1 macro work, bur rather for general close-up work, which IMO is where it shines. Folks can do tests and more tests of the CV125, but in the end it is not the sharpest, not the best corrected, etc. However, I would sell my Otus lenses before I would sell the CV-125. And I would sell ALL of my lenses before I sold the APO El Nikkor 105. That's my view.

[KarlMera]

For me the best non af macro lenses are the apo-digitar 5,6/120 macro and the apo-digitar 5,6/80 M, and the only good corrected af-lens is the sigma 150 OS.

[Roland Vink]

And I do not understand why Voigtlander did not offer their new 65mm Macro in Nikon format.

The back focus distance is too short for an SLR camera, to fit on a Nikon camera would require a new design.

[Michael Erlewine]

For me the best non af macro lenses are the apo-digitar 5,6/120 macro and the apo-digitar 5,6/80 M, and the only good corrected af-lens is the sigma 150 OS.

I hear you and those are fine lenses, but just sharpness is not enough IMO, and this is where folks differ.

I have two copies of the Schneider-Kreuznach APO-Digitar f/5.6 120mm MC lenses, each slightly different
I have a Schneider-Kreuznach Componon-s f/4 80mm lens
2 copies of the Nikkor AM-ED 120mm f/5.6 lens
1 copy of the Nikkor AM-ED 210mm f/5.6 lens (heavy)

and other industrial or "exotic" lenses for Nikon F-mount.

None of them compare, IMO, to the APO Nikkor 105mm f/5.6, because of the "style."

I also had, but sold the APO Nikkor 210mm f/5.6 lens, which is very rare, but very heavy and while equal to the 105mm version, it did NOT outperform the APO El Nikkor 105mm so, as mentioned, I sold it.

So, we photographers seem to differ all over the place, but at least we are in the same ballpark with the above mentioned lenses.


Photo of the APO El Nikkor 210mm lens that I have recently sold.

[JKoerner007]

When all is said and done, IMO, the CV-125 APO Lanthar is the best all-around lens for close-up work I know of. This may be sad and points out the need today for a really, really good macro lens for the Nikon mount. Nikon is, IMO, years behind offering one. And I do not understand why Voigtlander did not offer their new 65mm Macro in Nikon format. It has a lot in common with the CV-125. Or, for that matter, they could re-issue the CV-125.

I have the various Zeiss Otus series (and the 135mm that I consider Otus), and the Zeiss lenses are better corrected and sharper, but they are not meant for close-up work. When it comes right down to where the rubber meets the road, I can always reach for my CV-125.

There is a special quality to the CV-125, call it draw or style or whatever....anyway you want to spell it; the look of images shot with the CV-125 have a special quality. If we move to bellows-based work, then IMO the APO El Nikkor 105mm has the same speicial qualities and is even more useful (to me) than the CV-125. In my experience sheer "sharpness," correction, and so on without some special qualities, even if they are caused by defects (photographically) like the Nikkor "O" CRT lens, which may not be made for "white " light and it it is curved, etc. But its style is almost unique and very lovely.

I don't use the CV-125 for 1:1 macro work, bur rather for general close-up work, which IMO is where it shines. Folks can do tests and more tests of the CV125, but in the end it is not the sharpest, not the best corrected, etc. However, I would sell my Otus lenses before I would sell the CV-125. And I would sell ALL of my lenses before I sold the APO El Nikkor 105. That's my view.

Here here.

Funny that you mention you'd sell your Oti in favor of the CV ... as I am again putting up my Zeiss 135 Apo Sonnar up for sale. (Second time selling one.)

I actually love the Zeiss lens, and I respect its strengths, but in the end I can't get past the fact it is a heavier, more awkward, infinitely-less-versatile tool as the Voigtlander 125 Apo Lanthar.

Almost universally, the Zeiss is left at home; without exception the CV 125 comes with me. I, too recognize the Zeiss is sharper, but the colors I get from it seem natural. In fact, that is what I love most about the CV is the sublime, authentic, subtle colors ... and the dreamy bokeh. It is razor-sharp (or sharp enough) ... but it's a natural sharpness, not too overdone so that it looks weird or unnatural.

I think that might be the key: with the Zeiss, I am in awe of 'the sharpness,' and the colors don't seem natural (almost over-saturated). I find myself paying more attention to 'the photograph details' rather than the subject.

With the CV, I am simply in awe of the subject ... the lens presents my subject so perfectly (just the right amount of color, just the right amount of sharpness) that I want to reach out and touch that subject. The Zeiss images look surreal to me; the CV images look like perfect iterations of what I was seeing and trying to capture. I think therein lies the difference, at least to me.

I am actually in the process of selling/upgrading almost every lens I have now ... but the CV has a permanent home.

The author of the article, O'Toole, that Chambeshi referenced, doesn't understand the lens (he doesn't actually use it ... he just borrowed one) ... and is testing it clinically (for CA only) ... unwittingly at its worst proximity.

If he used it as it was intended to be used (and where it truly shines) ... beautiful bokeh stacks, @ f/2.5 to f/4, wide-open, he would junk the Sigma ... which cannot compare in either bokeh, wide-open sharpness, or authentic color reproduction. But then again he is sponsored by Sigma ...

Here are a couple CV shots (a few I may have posted already) to show the subtle, intricate, realistic colors captured by what I believe to be the best walk-around macro I have ever used.



Arizona Mantid ♀ by John A. Koerner II, on Flickr



Honey Bee by John A. Koerner II, on Flickr

It's like you can reach out and pluck them off their perches.

[Michael Erlewine]

Here here.

Funny that you mention you'd sell your Oti in favor of the CV ... as I am again putting up my Zeiss 135 Apo Sonnar up for sale.

The CV-125 is not a better lens than the Zeiss Oti, just better "all-around," if you understand my meaning. I don't have to choose only one lens and I use about half a dozen or so lenses all the time.

I am considering getting the Sigma 150mm OS Macro. Is there anything more you can tell me about that lens. They say it is very well corrected. Any thoughts?

As for various technical tests, etc. from the so-called "techspurts,"  I no longer trust many. You have to use a lens yourself and for more than a day or two in order to understand what it can do for you. In fact, I am slowly becoming a stranger to all of the online photography forums. I no longer get much out of the photo geeks and the fan-boys. I don't post photos here much anymore because half the comments just miss the point, IMO. I am not interested in others telling how they would compose my photos unless I ask for that (and I don't). I know it's just me, but that's all I have to work with, my own eye and sense of photography..

I am still doing lots of photography, but don't bother to share it, except a few on my Facebook blog each day. I do continue to track down lenses and buy them, just because I want to see for myself what's happening. Then I keep them or sell them. More and more of my work is done with the Cambo Actus and tilt. It's like I have come full circle, back to just taking photos for my own interest.

Winter is coming on here, so I am looking at some indoor projects.

[JKoerner007]

The CV-125 is not a better lens than the Zeiss Oti, just better "all-around," if you understand my meaning.

I do. Perfectly.

I don't have to choose only one lens and I use about half a dozen or so lenses all the time.

I subscribe to the biological truth: no two competitors can occupy the same ecosystem. One will prevail.

The Zeiss, while technically sharper, can't do 1/10th the things I usually need to do ... that the CV can do ... while the CV can do anything the Zeiss can do (and then some) ... close enough so that I don't need the Zeiss.

I am considering getting the Sigma 150mm OS Macro. Is there anything more you can tell me about that lens. They say it is very well corrected. Any thoughts?

To contradict what I said earlier, I think you'd be happier with the 180.

The 150 is nowhere near as sharp. Look at OToole's tests.

True, the 150 has better CA control, but that is easily fixed.

By contrast, you can't fix lack of sharpness wide-open + inferior bokeh.

As for various technical tests, etc. from the so-called "techspurts,"  I no longer trust many. You have to use a lens yourself and for more than a day or two in order to understand what it can do for you. In fact, I am slowly becoming a stranger to all of the online photography forums. I no longer get much out of the photo geeks and the fan-boys. I don't post photos here much anymore because half the comments just miss the point, IMO. I am not interested in others telling how they would compose my photos unless I ask for that (and I don't). I know it's just me, but that's all I have to work with, my own eye and sense of photography..

Totally agree with you here.

I respect anyone's opinion with more experience than my own (esp. with a lens I have not owned before).

However, once I myself have used a lens, then I no longer care about anyone's opinion than my own ... because only I can apply the lens to my own needs and determine if it's suitable for what I want.

When I see a dude use a CV 125mm on a black-and-white letter, up close, and draw inferences from this primitive result ... I can only shake my head ... as he's failing to truly appreciate all of the subtleties of what the lens offers. Not to mention the fact that when he fails to see how dull/unsharp the Sigma 150 is wide-open, in comparison to how sharp the CV, it just makes me want to hit the *delete* button on the article. But, then again, Sigma pays for a lot of what he does ...

As you know, I did have the Sigma 180mm macro, which is a great lens IMO, but I prefer the CV 125.

When I need quick AF for a macro shot (say a butterfly on a flower), I use my 300mm VR II which is better in every way than both of them. Better reach, can keep more distance, and cropped images from the 300mm VR II equal most distance macro shots IMO.

I am still doing lots of photography, but don't bother to share it, except a few on my Facebook blog each day. I do continue to track down lenses and buy them, just because I want to see for myself what's happening. Then I keep them or sell them. More and more of my work is done with the Cambo Actus and tilt. It's like I have come full circle, back to just taking photos for my own interest.

In the end, that's all you can do: photography for yourself.

Me, I am purging what I have in anticipation of a few Nikkor AF lenses (FL ED) ... and getting rid of some AI-S lenses in favor of either Zeiss or elder pre-AI all metal lenses, just because.

Winter is coming on here, so I am looking at some indoor projects.

Yep. I am going to be working on some websites and such over winter, as well as finishing a high-mag, super-macro studio setup on my desk/credenza, in anticipation of a new spring.

Cheers.