Author Topic: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras  (Read 27194 times)

Frank Fremerey

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2016, 18:12:33 »
They have shutters in the lens. Have they not? Mine have
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Michael Erlewine

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2016, 18:26:52 »
They have shutters in the lens. Have they not? Mine have

Exactly right. The concept of trying to marry everything from my Nikon stuff to the X1D does not appeal to me, probably because it basically is not easily possible.
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bobfriedman

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PeterN

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2016, 20:24:32 »
to push MPs, sony has developed the bancklit sensor which (to my knowledge) basically means that they use both sides of the sensor to increase MPs and keep the pixel/photon/wharever size at acceptable levels. Fuji and Panasonic are working on an organic fnWXHNBVe4rkJ2. However, since fuji sil launch their own MF camera, an organic sensor based camera might not be on the horizon yet.
I am following these devdlopments with great interest but personally I would not invest yet in another system.

I am highly intrrested in your thoughts about the hasselblad. Keep us posted.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I might be interested in a few of your lenses. ;-)
Peter

David H. Hartman

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #19 on: September 30, 2016, 20:28:39 »
Anyway, I have been chomping at the bit for a year or so, waiting for Nikon to stop pussyfooting around and deliver me a high-end mirrorless camera or at least the successor to the D810, one with a 50 Mpx sensor, and preferably 75 Mpx. We all know that has not happened yet, with no hint of when it might take place. For my purposes, Nikon has gone AWOL, IMO.

You have lost me and you've done it right here.

Dave
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PedroS

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2016, 21:34:39 »
Michael - I dont have a clue about your thought process - and it doesnt matter. What does matter is that you are doing what you think you should be doing - you have given it a lot of thought it seems - and right or wrong - if you dont do it - you will never know. Life is short - do what you have to do. Good luck :) I am looking forward to your feedback

I always like such, as approach!
Great, and first of all have fun!

PedroS

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #22 on: September 30, 2016, 21:36:00 »
PhaseOne, Michael?
 8)

Erik Lund

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2016, 21:36:24 »
...
Anyway, I have been chomping at the bit for a year or so, waiting for Nikon to stop pussyfooting around and deliver me a high-end mirrorless camera or at least the successor to the D810, one with a 50 Mpx sensor, and preferably 75 Mpx. We all know that has not happened yet, with no hint of when it might take place. For my purposes, Nikon has gone AWOL, IMO.
...

What to say,,, I think you are out of line with those comments but what the heck it seems 'some people here' enjoy when someone stand up and trashes what others have worked hard on,,,

I continue to enjoy the D810 for what it is, I still see new possibilities with that camera and I'm still learning to use it better and better, still getting to know it, it does so many things like no other photographic tool I know of,,, I also still enjoy shooting my Leica M9 - 7 years old these days,,, Maybe I may ask what you think about that?
Please.

To me it's a complete mystery that you have to trash Nikon
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Michael Erlewine

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #24 on: September 30, 2016, 21:40:10 »
What to say,,, I think you are out of line with those comments but what the heck it seems 'some people here' enjoy when someone stand up and trashes what others have worked hard on,,,

I continue to enjoy the D810 for what it is, I still see new possibilities with that camera and I'm still learning to use it better and better, still getting to know it, it does so many things like no other photographic tool I know of,,, I also still enjoy shooting my Leica M9 - 7 years old these days,,, Maybe I may ask what you think about that?
Please.

To me it's a complete mystery that you have to trash Nikon

How do you figure I am trashing Nikon, other than saying clearly that for my work they are taking too long to offer something to upgrade to? Why see that as so negative? Trashing?  Not at all.
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Michael Erlewine

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #25 on: September 30, 2016, 21:42:10 »
I did not just impulsively decide on the Hasselblad X1D system, although I did impulsively order it one day. Before making this decision, I spent about a year or more exploring all the avenues I could beyond the many Nikon systems I had used over the years. In terms of other cameras, I purchased and tested the Pentax K3 and then the K1, with a particular interest in their Pixel-Shift – super-resolution. I found that for my work there were few native Pentax lenses that I could appreciate. I ended up mostly using some Voigtlanders in Pentax mount, the 125mm APO-Lanthar, the 90mm APO Lanther (original and newer models), the Zeiss Pentax PK Distagon 28mm ZK, the Sigma 24mm ART lens, and others.

While the Pixel-Shift feature of the Pentax cameras was fascinating (if limited), ultimately the Pentax was IMO too unfriendly with non-Pentax lenses for my work and Pentax lenses were not that distinctive. In addition, I bought and used the Sony A7R II, both by itself and in conjunction with various bellows cameras and systems. This Sony system was interesting, and I was already familiar with the Sony A7R and the Sony A7s. The A7R II was useful with the bellows systems, in particular the Cambo Actus. Still, it had problems, so that after a while I sold it while it still had value and am waiting for a higher-end upgrade from Sony with perhaps a larger sensor.

Here is a shot with the Pentax K1 and the Voigtlander APO 90mm lens in Pixel-Shift mode. When all things are equal, the result rivals MF images IMO.

I also looked at Large Format, lenses and systems, working with the Rollei X-Act 2, the Novoflex CASTBAL, and the Novoflex BALPRO systems. I investigated a whole series of large-format lenses, including both Copal implementations and barrel-type lenses from Schneider, Rodenstock, Zeiss, and other lenses. I did find out that there are some incredible bargains among these lenses, in particular in barrel-lens format. I went through about ten different LF lenses, of which I kept a few that I could not part with. Some of my findings can be seen here, for those who are possible interested. Many more volumes not yet released.

http://traffic.libsyn.com/spiritgrooves/DSLR_Close-Up.pdf

http://traffic.libsyn.com/spiritgrooves/DSLR_Close-Up_Volume_Two_v3.pdf

Something I learned from all of this is the value of the medium and large-format lenses and systems. Still, I assumed I would never spring for one. Too much money for my budget.  However, when most of the systems I was testing out showed various kinds of flaws for my particular work (close-up and stacked nature photos), by elimination I ended up face-to-face once again with medium format.

For me, all roads ended up at medium format, so when something relatively inexpensive appeared (the X1D), I decided, after studying the work of Ming Thein with Hasselblad, to take the plunge. So I did not go into this without some consideration.
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David H. Hartman

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #26 on: September 30, 2016, 22:11:56 »
To me it's a complete mystery that you have to trash Nikon

I think it's a part of a pattern of loose logic. Loose logic is a proper term. It means the logica steps or arguments presented do not support the [conclusion] or in this case multiple conclusions. This doesn't mean.the Hasselblad X1D won't serve Michael well. I would use caution if selling fine lenses at a loss.

Perhaps trshing Nikon seems to fill the gaps.

Dave
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Michael Erlewine

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #27 on: September 30, 2016, 22:22:34 »
I think it's a part of a pattern of loose logic. Loose logic is a proper term. It means the logica steps or arguments presented do not support the condition or in this case multiple conclusions. This doesn't mean.the Hasselblad X1D won't serve Michael well.

I would use caution if selling fine lenses at a loss.

Dave

I don't feel that I am trashing Nikon. Maybe it looks that way to others. Few could be as loyal, especially to the Nikon D810. I do feel that Nikon has fiddled while we wait, and has not been able to lead us as at least I am used to having them do. It is a good question whether their lack of presence in the last year has led to my looking elsewhere (in addition to using their entire system as well) or are we are experiencing a perfect storm that has led to a crisis that (at least for my work) only some form of Medium Format system can satisfy. I am not the Lone Ranger here. Many others around the web, many posts, point to Nikon as having done very little to advance their position (and satisfy us) in the last year. 
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ArendV

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #28 on: September 30, 2016, 22:39:26 »
I am not the Lone Ranger here. Many others around the web, many posts, point to Nikon as having done very little to advance their position (and satisfy us) in the last year.

As Nikon only had action cams as really new announcements at Photokina, people seem to forget the D5/D500 release earlier this year that show serious advancements. 
I don't understand your logic in system choices and think you may experience some lens challenges with your new system - as you have faced before with all your previous systems -  but wish you all the best with the X1D which without a doubt is a nice camera.
Arend

Michael Erlewine

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Re: Goodbye Full-Frame Cameras
« Reply #29 on: September 30, 2016, 22:56:11 »
As Nikon only had action cams as really new announcements at Photokina, people seem to forget the D5/D500 release earlier this year that show serious advancements. 
I don't understand your logic in system choices and think you may experience some lens challenges with your new system - as you have faced before with all your previous systems -  but wish you all the best with the X1D which without a doubt is a nice camera.

There is little choice with lenses on the X1D, unless you want to revisit the older, larger Hasselblad lenses, which I don't. By choosing to try the X1D i accept the limited lens choice. I have many fine lenses in Nikon F-mount and use the D810 daily.
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