Black perspex / black mirror

[elsa hoffmann]

I am wanting to use a black reflective sheet  in studio -
Black plexiglass/perspex would be the effect I want  - but it is very expensive and scratches easily.
Perhaps using a black mirror ? (Black Scrying Mirror)
Does anyone have any experience with this?
I am wanting to use it with people shots - and obviously could be used for products too  - but using it for people increases the risk of scratching. - to be used as backdrop and on the floor

[David H. Hartman]

Black Plexiglass is the best I know of and it was damned expensive decades back. I have a sheet somewhere with the protective covering still on one side. It's hardened in place. I wonder about polishing it from time to time? Maybe something like Mother's Crome Polish or Simichrome Polish? As I recall a black mirror gives a double reflection which I don't care for. Maybe someone has a "magic" solution to the dilemma?

Dave Hartman the Hopeful

[elsa hoffmann]

David - thanks - from what I understand - I asked the supplier - they say they are still looking for the solution themselves. Nothing available to polish the scratches out as yet.

[charlie]

Regular glass with the backside painted black or laying on top of black paper or cloth is an alternative to a black mirror. This of course will still have the double reflection which would be quite apparent when shooting close up/product work but if you are shooting full length people shots it may only be seen when looking for it. I'd be worried about glass or mirrors breaking under the weight of a person though.

I suppose another option would be MDF or wood sanded very smooth, painted black, finished with polyurethane, and polished. Like a piano. The materials would be cheaper than plexi and polyurethane works well to resist scratches which is why its used on hardwood floors. It would be heavy and the days of effort involved with this makes black plexi sound like the better option. 

[elsa hoffmann]

Charlie I agree on the effort part thing. I also looked at melawood / melamine today - (thats what we call it here) - the stuff used for kitchen cupboards doors - high gloss. That is expensive - but the shoots are really very big. and of course solid, but stil movable - depending on the size one uses in the end. High Gloss granite - no one can move or afford it - but could give an interesting effect. I might hang out in the graveyards a bit...
But still - I believe perspex is going to give me the exact look I am after. I don't think much else will. But of course I am open to ideas.

[David H. Hartman]

Will the subjects stand on the Plexiglass or maybe just lean on it. If standing​ bear foot, socks or shoes?

I'd think polishing is possible but one would want a slick shine not a luster which is what the products I mentioned might do. Deep scratches might be smoothed with #400 or #600 then #1000 and #3000 wet/dry sandpaper. Wet of course.

I haven't tried polishing Plexiglass. I'm concerned about achieving only a luster and not an original shine.

Dave

[elsa hoffmann]

Everything I read and look at points me right back to plexiglass.
Using it for pac shots - eg jewelry should present no issues - easy to manage.
I definitely wanted to look at model sitting on it - and using it as a backdrop. Both these situations are problematic and expensive

[the solitaire]

So how about a steel plate (mounted on a lightweight aluminum frame for instance), painted by a professional painter to a piano black finish? It's quite sturdy to start with, and minor scratches can be polished out. Again, the option will be a tad on the expensive side, and if loaded with too much pressure/supported wrong it will bend, which will look ugly in the reflections, but it's far more durable then the plexiglass option. And lighter then granite or glass.

[Frank Fremerey]

Cheap solution would be a black foil like the ones used to make there huge bin bags of or in gardening and insulation as a steam barrier. Put it on a frame with rounded borders...

[Frank Fremerey]

PS. For black mirror in food I use a white mirror and oversized shadowing on the 90 degree angle to the camera

[Frank Fremerey]

Everything I read and look at points me right back to plexiglass.
Using it for pac shots - eg jewelry should present no issues - easy to manage.
I definitely wanted to look at model sitting on it - and using it as a backdrop. Both these situations are problematic and expensive

No Model sitting. For model sitting use a hardwood board and cover it in shiny foil like the one they use to foil cars with

[CS]

Everything I read and look at points me right back to plexiglass.
Using it for pac shots - eg jewelry should present no issues - easy to manage.
I definitely wanted to look at model sitting on it - and using it as a backdrop. Both these situations are problematic and expensive

Frank may have the answer for you.

Plexiglas will never be as reflective as it is when it's new. You cannot polish it to a mirror finish, in attempting to do so you can only add scratches to it, and even though they may be very small scratches, they're still going to degrade the original mirror finish. Not that plexiglas won't work, but the finish is delicate if you value it's mirroring qualities. If a model steps on it, oooops, there's a scratch, and another where the model sat. Might be good for backgrounds, but it's not durable enough for carrying weight the weight of models, furniture, chair legs, etc,  without leaving evidence of that presence. 

[elsa hoffmann]

Thanks for all the replies again - you all have given very valuable input - and nailed it - plexi is not an option. For now I have decided to pass on this thought. Till I dream up another thing (as I usually do)

[charlie]

Frank may have the answer for you.

Plexiglas will never be as reflective as it is when it's new. You cannot polish it to a mirror finish, in attempting to do so you can only add scratches to it, and even though they may be very small scratches, they're still going to degrade the original mirror finish. Not that plexiglas won't work, but the finish is delicate if you value it's mirroring qualities. If a model steps on it, oooops, there's a scratch, and another where the model sat. Might be good for backgrounds, but it's not durable enough for carrying weight the weight of models, furniture, chair legs, etc,  without leaving evidence of that presence.

Plexiglas is used all day everyday in studios around the globe, its pretty standard procedure to use if you want a mirrored surface. If you're shooting a full length portrait little scratches aren't going to show that well if at all. If you're shooting closeups of product then you'll need to be more careful. 4'x8' matte plexi is great on top of your seamless for reducing footprints on the paper, you can do cart wheels on it and it can last for months and it will extend the life of your seamless to boot.   Either way it should be thought of as an expendable item that will need at some point need replacement, just like paper backdrops. Plexiglas may not be an option, but its most likely the best tool for the job.