300mm f/4 PF VR E - VR issue?

[pkol]

Hi,

I received my copy of the 300mm f/4 PF VR last Friday. Since then the only opportunity I had to shoot outside was on Saturday so eager to try the new toy I went to the Copenhagen Women's March unfortunately I was only able to get there at 16:00.

I really enjoy using the lens, it's light, VR is amazing and the image quality is great... However when I was going through the photos I noticed that some showed what it seemed double contours... I was well aware of the issues with VR when the lens was released but I thought that Nikon fixed them a long time ago. By the way my lens SN is 2247xx, so well outside the troubled lenses (according to Nikon service Notice). I also noticed that the shots where the double contours appeared were at around 1/100s.

Here are some photos quickly processed in Lightroom, taken with D810 + 300mm f/4 PF

[pkol]

Since I noticed the double contour issue mentioned in the post above I decided to do some tests. For all the test shots the subject is 3m away from the camera (D810).

Now I'm a total novice regarding lens test, so I will explain what I've done and would like to get some guidance from the community regarding the tests and whether my copy of the lens needs to be serviced.

Here are 5 shots all handheld, in Shutter Priority, Auto WB and Auto ISO with VR Normal ON.

While I think the shots @ 1/20 and 1/160 are perfectly fine, I find a slight deterioration @ 1/80 and clearly double contours @ 1/100 and 1/125.

[pkol]

Next I decided to compare the shot @ 1/100, still handheld with VR Normal On, but now using:
1 Single release mode,
2 Single release mode and flash (SB-700), and
3 Mirror Up (MUP)

Here I find that using flash or MUP enhances substantially the IQ and eliminates the double contour issue.

[pkol]

Finally decided to use a tripod to test shooting @ 1/100 which one of the most problematic speeds with VR on.

So for the comparison below all the shots were taken with a tripod @ 1/100 and f/4 using a cable release and :
1 VR Off, MUP + EFCS
2 VR Normal On, MUP + EFCS
3 VR Off, Single Release
4 VR normal On, Single Release

In terms of IQ I think the order is 1>2>4>3. Here is the comparison:

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Double contours mean something has moved during the exposure. Typically caused by too long shutter speed in conjunction with inadequate support for the camera/lens or a camera not held steady enough. 

Do take the manufacturer's specification of how long shutter speed VR will allow with a big lump of salt. These numbers are obtained under the most optimal conditions. In practice in the field, VR is not enough if the shutter speeds get too long-. You probably would need 1/250 sec or faster for a 300 mm lens.

[pkol]

Although I have no experience with longer lenses I always read that the mirror shock can be problematic at certain shutter speeds.

I can see that between 1/80 and 1/125 I cannot get sharp photos handheld using VR. It seems that this is due to the mirror shock since I can consistently get sharp photos (without double contours) using Single release + VR On + MUP. Obviously this is not very practical and clearly not a solution in the field.

These tests left me with a few questions:
1 Why are the handheld photos (with VR on) below 1/60s consistently sharp and between 1/80s and 1/125s showing double contours?
2 Using flash @ 1/100s with VR On handheld does not show double contours. Why is that?
3 It seems to me that the issue of double contours is caused by mirror shock. Is that right? and if so why don't I see that on my Nikon 70-200 f/4?
4 I most likely am doing something wrong with these tests (this is the first time I try to test a lens in this manner). Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
5 Most importantly, do you think my lens should be returned or serviced?

It would be great to hear your thoughts about these questions.

Many thanks in advance for your time.

Kind regards,
Paulo

[pkol]

Double contours mean something has moved during the exposure. Typically caused by too long shutter speed in conjunction with inadequate support for the camera/lens or a camera not held steady enough. 

Do take the manufacturer's specification of how long shutter speed VR will allow with a big lump of salt. These numbers are obtained under the most optimal conditions. In practice in the field, VR is not enough if the shutter speeds get too long-. You probably would need 1/250 sec or faster for a 300 mm lens.

Many thanks for you reply Bjorn. I understand your point, but my question is how can I get consistently good results (no double contours) at shutter speeds slower than 1/60s. That is what I'm baffled with?

I also know that this is somewhat a mute point as one would need to use, as you point out, much faster shutter speed to handheld a 300mm. But the question remains in my mind and there must be an explanation.

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Tripod, or at least a monopod. Plus practice a lot. You need to be able to treat the camera in a relaxed, not tense, manner, even when the going gets touch and involuntary camera shake is easily introduced. VR might help, but is always a factor of unknown magnitude and importance. Don't rely solely on VR.

That being said, I sometimes am able to get very sharp images with the 300 PF at ridiculously slow speeds, in some cases down to 1/6 sec. Still I try not to do too much hand-held shooting with this lens.

[longzoom]

Nothing is wrong with your lens, Paulo. Doubles caused by wrong correlation between mirror box of D800-810 series, and VR-ed lenses. I have or had the same situations with many VR-ed lenses, especially with my 80-400G. There is some kind of engineering mistake, less so on the last D810. I set all of my zooms to ACTIVE position and left this setting forever.   It is helping somewhat, just try to avoid 1/125 +/- 30%.  Beautiful camera is that D810, with the best sensor on the market. Yeah, we can't always win...  Good luck!   LZ

[chris dees]

I have one of the earlier copies (202xxx) and after the fix I still have (minor) problems at 1/80 - 1/160

It helps when you use a grip on your D810 (or even a bracket).

[Erik Lund]

A benefit of these new cameras like the D810 is that it is easy to just turn up the ISO to avoid slow or troubled shutter speeds.

Another work around is to buy the battery grip (and the large battery from the D4) this will add more weight to the camera and stabilise the shot.

Back ground double lines are a VR risk.

I think your images from lovely Copenhagen are very fine!

You could always try my lens,,, Seems you are in CPH,,,

[Øivind Tøien]

There is some consensus out there that adding a tripod collar to the 300mm PF (used to improve how the lens is gripped and increase inertia) can improve VR performance on troubled bodies.

[Erik Lund]

Yes, that would also help - Good point!

[pkol]

Many thanks for all your comments and suggestions.

While I do understand that VR does detract from IQ and should only be used sparsely I am still dumbfound regarding the VR performance within a narrow band of shutter speeds. i will have to test the lens on my D750, but anedoctely it seems to be affected in a similar manner. I might be wrong about this and will have to test it to be sure.

It seems to me that most of you think that my lens VR behaviour is normal for this lens. I wanted to make sure that I did not get a "lemon" at least with regards to VR related issues.

I was hoping that, given the knowledge in the NG community, I would get some answers or at least some pointers towards answering these questions:
1 Why are the handheld photos (with VR on) below 1/60s consistently sharp and between 1/80s and 1/125s showing double contours?
2 Using flash @ 1/100s with VR On handheld does not show double contours. Why is that?
3 It seems to me that the issue of double contours is caused by mirror shock. Is that right? and if so why don't I see that on my Nikon 70-200 f/4?

These questions are still echoing in my head and I do not have the experience/knowledge to address them. It is very possible that the test I did were not adequate to provide any usefull information towards unconvering possible answers.

Once again many thanks for your time.

Regards,
Paulo

[pkol]

I think your images from lovely Copenhagen are very fine!

You could always try my lens,,, Seems you are in CPH,,,

Many thanks for your offer. I moved to Copenhagen in the summer of 2015 and am enjoying my time here.

It would be great to meet you.

Regards,
Paulo