Author Topic: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.  (Read 22811 times)

Erik Lund

  • Global Moderator
  • **
  • Posts: 6485
  • Copenhagen
    • ErikLund.com
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2016, 11:42:07 »
And any scratch or even dust speck on the rear element will also show itself in the out of focus highlights, also for longer focal length lenses,,,
Erik Lund

richardHaw

  • Cute Panda from the East...
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 3142
  • Your lens loverboy
    • Classic Nikkor Maintenance and DIY
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2016, 15:26:02 »
very sharp wide open :o :o :o (Nikkor-S.C)

Akira

  • Homo jezoensis
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 12532
  • Tokyo, Japan
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2016, 17:45:05 »
As most Leica lenses probably had quite short focal lengths and few were retrofocus, the repair tech's statement is understandable.

I can confirm; Even a hint of a fingerprint or a smear will affect image quality on wide angle Leica M lenses.

Indeed the repair person was talking about Summar 50/2.0 (of double Gaussian design) with fairly well scratched front element but otherwise very clean optics.  I bought it for 18,000 JPY (!) and confirmed that the image was not affected.  The lens had awful background bokeh but fantastically dreamy foreground bokeh.
"The eye is blind if the mind is absent." - Confucius

"Limitation is inspiration." - Akira

Akira

  • Homo jezoensis
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 12532
  • Tokyo, Japan
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2016, 17:45:37 »
Rick, the S.C. image looks really sharp!
"The eye is blind if the mind is absent." - Confucius

"Limitation is inspiration." - Akira

David H. Hartman

  • NG Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2783
  • I Doctor Photographs... :)
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2016, 20:55:07 »
I have a 50/1.4 Nikkor-S Auto NK Japan No. 7350xx. It's very clean with a factory AI upgrade. I remember when first testing it on subjects in the neighborhood I was surprised at the image quality then said to my self, "I knew that." There is no hint of multi-coatings as it's probably a vintage 1969 lens. The primary thing to notice is flare and ghost when turned towards the sun. The lens brings back old memories.

Dave
Beatniks are out to make it rich
Oh no, must be the season of the witch!

Airy

  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 2611
    • My pics repository
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #20 on: October 27, 2016, 21:11:52 »
Rick, the S.C. image looks really sharp!

and the bokeh is typical of that lens too. One likes it or not - it delivers a "special effect" and should be used a such.
Airy Magnien

Akira

  • Homo jezoensis
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 12532
  • Tokyo, Japan
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #21 on: October 27, 2016, 21:35:38 »
and the bokeh is typical of that lens too. One likes it or not - it delivers a "special effect" and should be used a such.

Yes, that is the interesting point of using older lenses.
"The eye is blind if the mind is absent." - Confucius

"Limitation is inspiration." - Akira

John Geerts

  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 9148
  • Photojournalist in Tilburg, Netherlands
    • Tilburgers
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #22 on: October 27, 2016, 21:50:15 »
Yes, very nice circular bokeh. I have the B-version from 1967.  Close-up it is very sharp wide open, with a nice touch of vignetting. At a distant it's a bit hazy, like the 50/1.2 wide open.  Stopping down to f/2 gives already overall very sharp images.    It's easier to focus than the later 1.4's.

Roland Vink

  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 1525
  • Nikon Nerd from New Zealand
    • Nikon Database
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2016, 22:35:28 »
I read long ago that both Nikon and Canon double coated and multi coated lenses before Pentax stared advertising multi coated lenses. I've seen a 45 GN that was multi coated but lacked a C to indicate multi coating. It's possible that a surfaces are not multi coated. Given the way Nikon produced there run of a lens then didn't return to that lens for many months they probably wanted to sell down their single coated inventory before advertising multi coated lenses.

I wonder how much is known about when specific lenses had unadvertised upgrades to their coatings?

It is possible the serial number ring (with the "C" designation) has been swapped between single and multi-coated lenses during repair. The single coated 45GN has amber and purple coatings, while the multi-coated version has darker green-blue-purple coatings.

I know of three Nikkors which are multi-coated and lack the "C" to indicate multi coating:
  • Nikkor-S 55/1.2 multicoated on one (?) of the rear elements, shows as a green reflection at certain angles - unlike the amber, blue and pink of single coated lenses. Some claim this was the first to be multi-coated. I have no information about when this was introduced, it was probably a silent upgrade. It is at least found on later lenses marked "Nippon Kogaku Japan" dating from the very late 1960s or 1970.
  • Nikkor-N 35/1.4 - first Nikkor to be multi-coated on all lens surfaces, from 1970. The first series are marked the old style "Nikkor-N Nippon Kogaku Japan", then "Nikkor-N Nikon", and finally "Nikkor-N.C Nikon" which acknowledges the multi-coating.
  • Nikkor-N 28/2 - Second Nikkor to be multi-coated on all lens surfaces, released a few months after the 35/1.4, but with similar history.
All other fully multi-coated lenses were already introduced with the "C" designation.

It seems at first Nikon considered multi-coating like Nano Crystal Coating of today, to be applied only to specific surfaces to control flare and that otherwise single-coated lenses were sufficient. Perhaps they later realised that multi-coating was cheap enough and robust enough to be applied to all surfaces. And even later the marketing department realised it might be good to advertise the new coating by putting a "C" on the lens!

I also wonder if some of the older lenses were more than just single-coated. Some of the later so-called single-coated lenses have coatings with darker reflections and more colours than earlier lenses. For example the gauss Nikkor-P 105/2.5 and newer Nikkor-Q 135/3.5 (7 aperture blades) have coatings which are a deeper blue than the older Nikkor-Q 135/3.5 (6 aperture blades), which suggests an improvement in coating.

Also the Nikkor-UD 20/3.5 has purple-amber coatings which seem surprisingly transparent for a single coated lens, and strangely there is no multi-coated Nikkor-UD.C version. Was it was already multicoated (or at least double coated)? The following 20/4 belongs to an era when all lenses were multi-coated, yet the coatings look very similar to the older 20 UD ...  ???

richardHaw

  • Cute Panda from the East...
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 3142
  • Your lens loverboy
    • Classic Nikkor Maintenance and DIY
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2016, 23:35:36 »
I have a 50/1.4 Nikkor-S Auto NK Japan No. 7350xx. It's very clean with a factory AI upgrade. I remember when first testing it on subjects in the neighborhood I was surprised at the image quality then said to my self, "I knew that." There is no hint of multi-coatings as it's probably a vintage 1969 lens. The primary thing to notice is flare and ghost when turned towards the sun. The lens brings back old memories.

Dave
Hello, David. Yes. anything near the frame :o :o :o

richardHaw

  • Cute Panda from the East...
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 3142
  • Your lens loverboy
    • Classic Nikkor Maintenance and DIY
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #25 on: October 27, 2016, 23:54:51 »
this is the weakness of the lens. :o :o :o

the glass's frame looks to be in focus but it's not sharp due to artefacts and that ugly flare that fills the frame at times. this looks like a characteristic of the Nikkor-S 50 series...

but it does make the image more "painterly" and organic, things that we do not usually see in modern optics these days.

Akira

  • Homo jezoensis
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 12532
  • Tokyo, Japan
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #26 on: October 28, 2016, 00:43:16 »
The background bokeh of the older version looks smoother.
"The eye is blind if the mind is absent." - Confucius

"Limitation is inspiration." - Akira

richardHaw

  • Cute Panda from the East...
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 3142
  • Your lens loverboy
    • Classic Nikkor Maintenance and DIY
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #27 on: October 28, 2016, 01:04:16 »
The background bokeh of the older version looks smoother.

Sorry! forgot to mention that it is from the C :o :o :o

Akira

  • Homo jezoensis
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 12532
  • Tokyo, Japan
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #28 on: October 28, 2016, 01:14:19 »
No worries, Rick.  Such a lens of character shows fairly big difference of bokeh according to the focusing distance and the distance between the focused subject and the background.   :o :o :o
"The eye is blind if the mind is absent." - Confucius

"Limitation is inspiration." - Akira

richardHaw

  • Cute Panda from the East...
  • NG Supporter
  • **
  • Posts: 3142
  • Your lens loverboy
    • Classic Nikkor Maintenance and DIY
Re: Nikkor-S 50mm f/1.4 discussion and variants comparison.
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2016, 17:13:04 »
not so much while I was testing it. the difference in focus is within a ft and the image on the VF didn't change much as far as the look of the flares,etc :o :o :o