V1 and color IR

[Olivier]

While I am very satisfied with the B&W IR shots I get from my modified V1 (720nm), the original files are quite poor in color information. typically the a and b channels in Lab mode are extremely narrow. See the picture below, I has to fight hard to extract something from the file(s)...
I may be looking  for an alternative in the future, as I keep fond memories of what my D80 had to offer. Bjorn produces great pictures with his D5300 obviously, but I am sure he will make any camera shine.

I find and evf invaluable for IR, and very cool as well!
What are decent options nowadays? It has to be cheap of course, and APS-C would be OK with its increased DOF control over the V1.
Did anyone ever play with a X-E1 IR? Or a Nex-6? anything else?
Basically I need something small that I could modify by myself, offering great IR color, with an evf, all that in a very affordable package... Fuji would be ideal as I already have lenses and adapters for the system.

thanks for any tip
Olivier

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Not all IR captures have the nice embedded colours, far from it. This is one of the true IR enigmas.

You might get more (false) colours by opting for a filter that cuts at shorter wavelengths than the 720 nm in your V1. However, as IR usually is registered mainly in the red channel of digital cameras, putting on a filter that lets a lot of true red through tends not to be the wisest of choices. Maybe you can drop down to 665 nm or so, but be aware of going any further into the visible band as you besides the blending of red and IR also will encounter colour fringing because visible and IR focus planes are different.

Not familiar with the Fuji models, but a cheap NEX or Panasonic ought to be a good starting point for a new modified camera. Perhaps there are cheap alternatives in the Fuji X-range too.

[Olivier]

Thanks Bjørn

I am usually not impressed by pictures taken with filters bridging too much the visible/IR domains, actually I wonder if they don't look to normal yet abnormal to me: very clean with beautiful false colors. I kind of enjoy better the more gritty images I get when I extract colors from 720nm images... they depart further from reality and fit the IR bill better, for me at least.
Indeed I also had variabilities with the nikon bodies, some shots were rich in IR colors, some were really deprived of it. With the V1 I mostly (almost only) get the latter however. It is annoying that I don't understand the physics of it, it is just unpredictible and I can't find simple correlations (sunny or overcast, artificial lighting or natural...).

This seems to indicate there is some hope with Fuji as well: https://markhilliardatelier-blog.com/2013/04/01/x-pro-1-720nm-infrared-faux-color-and-bw-post-processing/
Thanks again
Olivier

[BEZ]

Hello Olivier,
I have moved from the D200 to a XE-1 720nm and I'm very happy with the images   ....I have little experience with false colour but the fuji records more than my D200 did.

Be aware most fujinon lenses do not perform well in infrared  ...the 14mm is superb, 35mm f1.4 is very good. Unfortunately they are the only primes that perform well. Some zooms do it seems but are of no interest to me. I also use the little samyang 8mm with good success.

The other advantage is you can share lenses with your XT-1, as I do with my X-pro.

Cheers

[Frank Fremerey]

I cannot conmtribute anything to technicalities, but this shot - like many of your shots - really touches me. It is so visionary and deep, well composed and moody. Thank you!!!

[Olivier]

Bez, thanks for the tip. I will investigate. I read the cheap 16-50 zoom is good in IR. If it is anything equivalent to the Nikkor 18-55 kit zoom in IR, it is enough for me. I will also look for info on how my Samyang 12mm f/2 behaves.

Frank, thank you very much for the nice words.

[Fons Baerken]

i like the image, and the clouds show a lot of noise, too much postprocessing?

[BEZ]

The 16-50mm is mostly free of hotspots but the image quality is mediocre in infrared  ...unlike the nikkor 18-55mm.

The recommended zoom is expensive, I can not remember which one. And I have no experience using it.

I have put the 16-50 aside and have settled on the 14mm, 35mm and 8mm in my bag  ...They all perform well.

I have no love for zooms so will have to use one of my old nikkors if I want more reach.

Cheers

[chris dees]

While I am very satisfied with the B&W IR shots I get from my modified V1 (720nm), the original files are quite poor in color information. typically the a and b channels in Lab mode are extremely narrow. See the picture below, I has to fight hard to extract something from the file(s)...
I may be looking  for an alternative in the future, as I keep fond memories of what my D80 had to offer. Bjorn produces great pictures with his D5300 obviously, but I am sure he will make any camera shine.
.............

How do you get those colors?
I have a V1 IR (720nm) as well, but can't get some color out of it (only swapping red and blue channel)
I'm thinking of having another V1 converted to 595nm (or something like that).

[Olivier]

Hi Chris,
I usually push colors by playing with many sliders, not always the same...
Often I abuse of the "structure" slider in Nik Viveza, then change to Lab colors and narrow very steaply the b channel, and then go back to Viveza and have fun with contrasts, hue, not so much with saturation (this was actually already done in Lab mode on the b channel)... This is more or less what I did here but I can't tell you precisely as I don't take notes, sorry (don't think I prefer to keep it for myself!). This is what I like to do, but it alters and damages the picture very much. a lot of info is lost in the process but I don't mind.
Still, I am disappointed in the variety of colors I manage to get from the V1 (720nm IR).

[Olivier]

Now I have finally found a way to get colors with the V1IR: shoor in conditions with very little IR... Visible leakage will do the rest.

The two shots below were taken from the same vantage point:

the first one during the day and it exhibits the usual IR features (dark water, white folliage)
the second at night, the light mostly coming from bigh LED lights.

while very bright to my eyes, the led lights were barely visible in my EVF, indicating the very low amount of IR they emit. I had to push to very long exposure times to get something, obviously with a lot of visible light mixed whatever IR was available.
Of course this is not what I was hoping for, but at least I get colors...

[Akira]

Olivier, frankly speaking, and with no intention of putting your efforts down, the last "color" image doesn't really look interesting.  On the contrary, I find the very first image of this thread really nice.

I'm not sure if the way to extract colors you found is viable.  Utilizing the visible leakage and less IR under LED lightings might be virtually the same effect as you would use a lighter IR filter (with the leakage of shorter wavelength), as Bjørn mentioned above.

[Olivier]

Akira, I totally agree! The second shot is almost a joke, I also find it boring but I just wanted to show that the modified camera is able to produce strong colors when the conditions are totally wrong... Of course, not IR colors.
Both shots were just downsized and converted to sRGB.
Thank you!
Olivier