Color banding in Photoshop

[charlie]

I am seeing color banding on files open in photoshop.
I do not see color banding on the same file open outside of photoshop, such as in lightroom. 

Generally this occurs in darker areas of the image with uniform color such as skies, or in the example below a red wall.
It happens with black and white images as well.

My work flow starts as a .NEF in Lightroom opened into Photoshop as 16 bit Tiff. The banding is only seen in Photoshop and once the file is saved and viewed as a Tiff in Lightroom again or exported as a JPG and viewed outside of Ps or Lr there is no banding present.

Seems to be a Photoshop specific issue and I am hoping someone might be able to provide some insight as to why this might be happening.
Monitor is a calibrated NEC, I have a dual monitor setup and it is visible on both monitors. Video card drivers are up to date and I've tried two different video cards with the same issue. It was happening on Windows 7 and is still happening after a fresh Windows 10 install. I am using Photoshop CC and it has been happening through several updates. 

Any suggestions are welcomed.

This example picture is two separate screen grabs of Photoshop & Lightroom and has been brightened to exacerbate the issue.

[Bjørn Rørslett]

What are the colour settings in Photoshop ? Your monitor profile? Must be a mismatch somewhere.

[charlie]

Color settings in Photoshop are set as seen in the attached picture.
ProPhoto RGB working space is the only thing I changed from the default settings.
Lightroom is set to export to Photoshop as ProPhoto RGB TIFF 16bit.

As for my monitor it is an NEC and I use spectraview II to calibrate it, the software which came with it. Outside of Spectraview II I have not changed settings anywhere else in regards to monitor profiles.

[elsa hoffmann]

Do I understand correctly - the file in the image is an unsaved but edited NEF image in photoshop?
would you mind uploading a NEF file (perhaps to dropbox) ? I am quite interested in this and would need to see what happens my side

[BW]

I have cheked my settings in PS CC and the only thing that differs is the working spaces. You use ProPhoto RGB which is outside your monitors working space, I guess. I use sRGB which is the colorspace that my monitor can show and within the calibrated working space. But if you use CC these settings should be synchronized between PS and Lightroom.

[charlie]

Do I understand correctly - the file in the image is an unsaved but edited NEF image in photoshop?
would you mind uploading a NEF file (perhaps to dropbox) ? I am quite interested in this and would need to see what happens my side

I can upload a NEF in the morning, though I suspect there is nothing wrong with the files themselves.
The file can be either an unsaved NEF, a saved Tiff, or a JPG. When it is viewed in photoshop I see banding, when viewed outside of photoshop I don't see banding. Unedited files can display some banding but it is more apparent once contrast is boosted.

I should also mention that the banding is not visible in photoshop when viewing files at actual size, at 100%. It is mostly gone when the image is scaled to 66% and above, anything under that and the banding appears. I am primarily working with D800 files. It acts as though scaling the photo smaller so it fits on the screen causes a loss of color bit depth.

I have cheked my settings in PS CC and the only thing that differs is the working spaces. You use ProPhoto RGB which is outside your monitors working space, I guess. I use sRGB which is the colorspace that my monitor can show and within the calibrated working space. But if you use CC these settings should be synchronized between PS and Lightroom.

Thanks for checking. I've tried with both sRGB as well ProPhoto RGB working spaces and both have the same results. I also compared the settings to photoshop on my Macbook which does not have this problem.

[elsa hoffmann]

that will be great. I agree with you about the problem not being in the file - but rather due to the way PS handles the file

[simsurace]

I should also mention that the banding is not visible in photoshop when viewing files at actual size, at 100%. It is mostly gone when the image is scaled to 66% and above, anything under that and the banding appears. I am primarily working with D800 files. It acts as though scaling the photo smaller so it fits on the screen causes a loss of color bit depth.

I would hazard a guess and say that the banding should not be visible at 100%, 66.66%, 50%, 33.33%, etc., i.e. the zoom levels accessible by using the 'Zoom In' and 'Zoom Out' commands, and visible for intermediate settings accessed via e.g. the scroll wheel.

The display of images at intermediate zoom levels is suboptimal in many ways, the sharpness of the view being the most obvious, but banding of color might just be another way in which this manifests itself. I always stick to the even zoom levels listed above.

[elsa hoffmann]

I do agree with Simsurance - he just could put it better than me - so I didnt even try

I still would like to see how it displays my side though

[Almass]

I can upload a NEF in the morning, though I suspect there is nothing wrong with the files themselves.
The file can be either an unsaved NEF, a saved Tiff, or a JPG. When it is viewed in photoshop I see banding, when viewed outside of photoshop I don't see banding. Unedited files can display some banding but it is more apparent once contrast is boosted.

I should also mention that the banding is not visible in photoshop when viewing files at actual size, at 100%. It is mostly gone when the image is scaled to 66% and above, anything under that and the banding appears. I am primarily working with D800 files. It acts as though scaling the photo smaller so it fits on the screen causes a loss of color bit depth.

Thanks for checking. I've tried with both sRGB as well ProPhoto RGB working spaces and both have the same results. I also compared the settings to photoshop on my Macbook which does not have this problem.

LoL.......Just saw this thread. It is a very simple answer, if your file is 16bpt and you view it at under 100%, the software is showing the 16bpt as 8bpt hence the banding. This has to do as well with using the CPU to render or the GPU. If you move the image window around then you would or might notice a change.

In other words, to view a 16bpt, you have to be a 100%. I work on a souped up MAC Pro station dual cinema monitors as well with a Wacom Intuos Pro and all the Jazz.......and what I do is have on one monitor usually the left monitor the picture fitted at whatever viewing percentage 16bpt which in fact is viewed at 8bpt and the right monitor is at 100% and/or larger at 16bpt for retouching and processing. This applies to PS CC. You might get away with it on CS6.
 
Here is my set up......

[charlie]

The cigar is a nice touch 

So what you are saying, Almass, is that you are seeing banding on images as well?

I keep tools, layer palette, etc on my second monitor so the image  on the NEC is constantly zooming between +/-100% view and +/- 16% while retouching. 
Yes, I get that the previews at smaller sizes are never as good as the 100% view but it seems that photoshop is particularly poor in this regard on my machine, especially when compared to the same file being edited in Lightroom (minor banding) or Capture One (no banding). 

As I move the curves adjustment up and down there is a cascade of banding across the image which moves like the aurora borealis across the sky and makes judging the right amount of adjustment needed frustrating on some images.

I've attached an animated gif of me raising and lowering a curve adjustment on a picture filled with dark blue sky to demonstrate, it is worse in the animated gif because of quality, but the same effect is happening on my screen to a lesser degree. 

And here is a link to download the NEF in question, as well as the GIF
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hwjwxww45vq3eqy/AAC7foMFS7WOUgRU2xC10fmqa?dl=0

If I'm not the only one seeing banding in photoshop then I will continue to live with it, it just seems worse than I would expect it to be and worse than it used to be.

[elsa hoffmann]

Some Banding is visible my side too  (PS6)

[charlie]

Then so it goes.
Thank you for looking into it, Elsa.

[elsa hoffmann]

I have seen people on some FB group mentioning that they seem to think banding is a new(ish) issue in PS - and that perhaps it's due to some updates by Adobe - for what this info is worth..

[charlie]

Thanks for the info, Elsa

I recall first noticing it 5 or 6 months ago, and when I saw it I remember thinking it was a new issue but I don't think it was directly related to an update unless I didn't notice it for a little while.
I do also see it to a lesser degree on my macbook w/retina but on my PC w/NEC it is more noticeable.
Since it is happening on both of my machines as well as outside of my work flow on other peoples machines it seems as though there is not much I can do about it.