Author Topic: Painting with Lenses  (Read 44647 times)

Michael Erlewine

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Painting with Lenses
« on: January 01, 2016, 18:41:16 »
This is the beginning of a thread on what I call “Impressionistic” or “mood” lenses, many of them old styles of lenses being revived and manufactured. Some of our posters here have an interest in lenses like these, including Jakov Minić, Akira, myself, and others.

Not an historian, but it looks like interest in this type of lens came from the Carl Zeis Jena Biotar 58mm f/2 lens from the 1920s. This lens became famous for its sharpness and its extreme bokeh, when shot wide open. Often used on the micro 4/3 systems, it was available mainly in M42 mounts, but apparently also in Exacta and Paktina mounts. It has 6 lens elements and a minimum focusing distance of 60 cm (23.6 inches). The original Biotar had a black finish, but subsequently silver and other finishes were offered.

The Biotar is an example of what is called a Double-Gauss Lens, which involves:

“… two back-to-back Gauss lenses (a design with a positive meniscus lens of the object side and a negative meniscus lens on the image side)  making two positive meniscus lenses on the outside with two negative meniscus lenses inside them. The symmetry of the system and the splitting of the optical power into many elements reduces the optical aberrations within the system.”  --’ Wikipedia.

The Biotar has been systematically copied by other manufacturers, most notably the Russians, who mass-produced this style lens with copies like the Helios 44 58mm f/1 and others, most often with the M42 mount, or with a M39 thread, especially for the Zenit cameras.

 These lenses have become legendary for what is called their “swirling bokeh. The lenses are very flare prone, quite heavy, and must be stopped down for normal photography. However, that is not how it is generally used these days. Instead, it is most often used wide open under sunny conditions, which does wild things with specular highlights and light, in general.

Perhaps the most common forms of these lenses are copies of the Zeiss Boitar 58mm f/2 made in Russia by KMZ, MMZ, and Jupiter from 1958 until the late 1990s, in particular the Helios M44-2 and the Helios-44M, both with 8 aperture blades, and a range of f/2 – f/16.  Both models function similarly, although the 44M is heavier and more solidly built. To reduce flare, a hood of some type is usually required.

The Zenit MC Helios 40-2 85mm lens with M42 mount, also Russian Made, is also a popular lens that displays similar light effects to those noted above. It takes a 67mm filter and lens hood.

The recent reissue by Lomography of the New Petzval Art Lens, a copy of a Viennese lens from 1840, is currently interesting filmmakers and photographers because of its sharpness and the swirly bokeh effect mentioned above. The Petzval has a focal length of 85mm, f/2.2 – f/16 and a 44mm image circle. It weighs 0.68 kg (24 ounces). A Nikon mount is available.

Another lens with similar characteristics is the FUJINON 55mm f/1.8 lens with a 42mm Screw Mount, often available on Ebay for a reasonable price.

And Lensbaby has recently released the Lens Baby Velvet 56mm f/1.6 for Nikon and Canon mounts, which is a sturdy lens, again, exhibiting the special bokeh, etc. we are looking at here.

Another lens worth considering is the CRT-Nikkor (Nikkor-O) 55mm f/1.2, which also can do wonderful things with light and focus.

I am not an expert on these lenses, but I have all except the Petzval (which I am resisting), and am gradually learning how to use them as I find the time. .

I thought this trend deserves its own general thread, so here it is.

Here is a sample photo on the Nikon D810 and the Lensbaby 56mm f/1.6 giving (not the best) example (I am just learning!) of what we might be after. Since I am a sharpness freak, I have to kind of hold my nose and shoot. I am also VERY interested in photographic impressionism, so I would like to learn this, if I can.
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rosko

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2016, 00:49:12 »
I thought this trend deserves its own general thread, so here it is.

I agree. This is a great idea as many of us like these ''impressionistic'' lenses.

The 44/2 helios 58mm f/2 is one of them and there are many different versions.

Mine is silver with 13 blades' iris (most of them have 8 blades) . However, it's not heavy at all, only 234g with both caps on my scale.

I got it from Ukraine, in great condition from a 100% rated Ebay seller.

Its original thread is M39, and it was delivered with a m39/m42 adapter which is stranded on it, so i use a m42/Nikon adapter and it's fine.

I don't really matter about sharpness, at least in this kind of photography. Bokeh is the main factor. :)

Few images :



Francis Devrainne

rosko

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2016, 00:55:11 »
Here is a pic made with few stacked shots just for sharpness wise.
Francis Devrainne

Ron Scubadiver

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2016, 02:12:39 »
The Bluebonnet grows prolifically in Texas and is the state flower.   

Bill De Jager

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2016, 04:27:24 »
Rosko, that lens has some interesting bokeh (shot 4262).  Ron, I don't think those are bluebonnets, which are in the pea family and have flowers typical of that family.


Fons Baerken

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2016, 10:38:01 »
There will be the reissue of the Meyer trioplans

http://www.meyer-optik-goerlitz.com/


Muscari are the bleu flowering bulbs


rosko

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2016, 10:40:58 »
Thanks, Bill.

These flowers are Grape hyacinth (Muscaris), from bulbous family, its taxonomy is quite complicated.

What I am sure is that it's not from the bean family (Papilionacea). :)
Francis Devrainne

Bjørn Rørslett

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2016, 11:42:41 »
Muscari is correct. This genus is now considered to belong to the Asparagus Family (Asperagaceae). As already stated, their taxonomy is quite convoluted so identification to species level might not always be possible.

Jakov Minić

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2016, 12:08:46 »
I have posted many photos with lenses that have cavities but character in many threads.
There's a dedicated one on the Rodenstock Heligon 100/1.6 and I have posted many photos made with the Helios Zenit 85/1.5 on various threads.
A bit more words on the Helios can be found here: http://jakov.nl/wp/2015/10/20/zenit-85-mm-f1-5-helios-40-2/

It goes without saying that these lenses don't produce images of character just by pointing them in the right direction They take getting used to, and if you don't like to use a lens that gives you less than a small number of keepers, these lense usually aren't for you. In time the number of keepers becomes greater, simply because you don't experiment with something that you know doesn't work from all the non keepers of the past.

Then again it all depends on the type of photography that you are into.
For me, it's all about enjoying the process of achieving the desired result.
That's what I love about photography!

Free your mind and your ass will follow. - George Clinton
Before I jump like monkey give me banana. - Fela Kuti
Confidence is what you have before you understand the problem. - Woody Allen

Wannabebetter

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2016, 12:13:18 »
Muscari is correct. This genus is now considered to belong to the Asparagus Family (Asperagaceae). As already stated, their taxonomy is quite convoluted so identification to species level might not always be possible.

I am taking quite a leap of faith but since I'm already jumping off the "fat girl", so-to-speak, might the erstwhile "stomach" in fact be a new species? (re: Kings Play Chess On Fat Girls Stomachs)

And Michael, thanks for starting this thread!

Bjørn Rørslett

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2016, 12:34:48 »
? afraid the depth of this is beyond my imagination ??

Fons Baerken

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2016, 12:38:37 »
Even the 35/1.4ais is a good candidate to achieve soapbubbles like bokeh and more lenses not yet mentioned here.
The choice of background is important and in post-processing one may accentuate a bokeh structure.

for instance


Peter Forsell

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2016, 12:42:34 »
? afraid the depth of this is beyond my imagination ??

I guess it's the mnemonic for the taxonomy order:
Kingdom, Phylum, Class, Order, Family, Genus, Species

Its relevance to this particular discussion escapes me completely though.

simato73

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2016, 13:48:51 »
I guess it's the mnemonic for the taxonomy order:
Kingdom, Phylum, Class, Order, Family, Genus, Species

Its relevance to this particular discussion escapes me completely though.

It may be a bit cryptic but relevant.
It refers to the species of bluebonnet, which was said to be difficult, if I understand correctly.
Simone Tomasi

Bjørn Rørslett

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Re: “Impressionistic” Lenses and How to Use Them
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2016, 13:58:13 »
The hierarchic scheme used for taxonomy has its relevance in that field, but for most real life situations, family + species (the latter implies genus) is all that is required. Wordplays might be fine to show you are a native speaker, but again, not relevant.

Putting this as relevant in the context of "impressionistic" lenses is far fetched though and I suggest the thread is put back on tracks.