NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Lens Talk => Topic started by: golunvolo on March 22, 2017, 16:55:10
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I recently came by a couple of El-Nikkors: 50mm 2.8 and 70mm 4.
It is there an adapter to an F mount? I tried the 50mm today and it was very nice.
Thanks in advance!
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They often have 39 mm (LTM) mount and thus any M39 to F adapter will do the trick.
The easiest solution for the *longer* EL-Nikkors is using a focusing extension; those with front 42 mm and rear F mount are pretty ubiquitous and tend to be not very expensive. A simple 42-39 step down ring is very cheap and allows you to mount LTM lenses to the helicoid. As it is inserted into the larger threads, it doesn't add any extra length to the set up.
Get the shortest possible extension if you intend to use the shorter EL-Nikkor or other [enlarger] lens heads. Otherwise getting infinity focus can be impossible and for the 50 mm class, usually impossible with a DSLR unless the lens is attached to a mirrorless camera.
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I recently came by a couple of El-Nikkors: 50mm 2.8 and 70mm 4.
It is there an adapter to an F mount? I tried the 50mm today and it was very nice.
Thanks in advance!
May I assume it is rather the f4/75mm??
Best to mount using a thin Nikon-M42 adapter, M42 focusing helicoid, M42-M39 adapter ring
in the sequence camera-to-lens, all to be found easily on ebay. Looks like that then (a thin
helicoid was used here)...
EL-Nikkor lens, thin M42-M39 ring, M42 focusing helicoid, Nikon adapter mounted:
(https://nikongear.net/revival/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pbase.com%2Fkds315%2Fimage%2F132151601%2Flarge.jpg&hash=55d61c28dd0e8ed2c96abfc53c1699d3f97c348c)
all screwed together:
(https://nikongear.net/revival/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pbase.com%2Fkds315%2Fimage%2F132151602%2Flarge.jpg&hash=84022ace6082240ce56fb5d247d10060f8dfec7b)
on camera, ready to shoot:
(https://nikongear.net/revival/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pbase.com%2Fkds315%2Fimage%2F132151609%2Flarge.jpg&hash=0cdfdb4b35d3f48be22652f50d9f007143dfe1d4)
This was special helicoid which allows infinity focusing using a 3.5/63mm EL-Nikkor btw.
Adapter alone lacks focusing, so does extension rings, makes not much sense IMHO ;-)
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Klaus, exactly what I had in mind :D
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May I assume it is rather the f4/75mm??
Yes, you may. That's a wonderful solution. Thank you both for the information.
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Another solution is to use a BR-2A reversing ring and a 40.5mm->52mm adapter ring and reverse mount the lens. This makes more sense if you're using it on a bellows or extension tube for greater than 1:1 magnifications.
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My experience with the F-mount using Df was that the 50mm f/4 EL-Nikkor can only work in the macro range, even with just M39-M42/M42-Ai. With M42 focusing helicoid (FH) throw in in-between it works in the macro range. Exactly as Dr Klaus had put together.
I do not have a 70mm f/4 EL-Nikkor, but a Fujinar-E 75mm f/4.5. With 2 sets of FH 12-17mm and 17-31mm I got infinity/long focus (to about 6m) and near range that roughly corresponds to the usual 0.6m to infinity. Not ideal, unless I can get a set of FH that goes from 12-31mm.
Metering was a challenge...
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The enlarger lenses are designed and corrected for closer ranges (in shooting lens terms). For example, 50/2.8 is for 1:8 and 75/4.0, for 1:5. Both are intended for even closer ranges than the venerable old Micro Nikkor 55/3.5 which was corrected for 1:10.
So, the inability to shoot distant subjects with these EL-Nikkors on Nikon DSLRs is of no problem to me.
As mentioned above, it is fairly easy to find the adapter or the combinations of adapters to attach L39 (LTM) mount lenses to F-mount cameras. Just get closer and shoot away!
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Thank you all again for your input. Parts are already ordered and in its way to my eager hands.
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I was once asked to run test several enlarging lenses by a camera store. There was an old and new style 50/2.8 EL Nikkor. Both were excellent performers. I owned a 50/4.0 and 75/4.0 EL-Nikkors. These are not only slower lenses but also simpler designs. I immediately replaced the 50/4.0 but still own the 75/4.0. As I recall I always used a 100/5.6 Componon-S over the 70/4.0 when possible.
The popular advice of the day was don't skimp on your enlarging lenses as that will limit all your lenses camera or something similar. I found this to be true and when I bought a heavy weight 10x critical grain focuser I found it to be extremely true. Properly alignment of the enlarger was also very important as a properly aligned enlarger allowed printing in the enlarging lens' sweet spot rather than stopping down for insurance.
I'd keep the 50/2.8 EL-Nikkor but I'd replace the 75/4.0.
Dave Hartman
[Checking an EL Nikkor brochure of the era, there was a 75mm but not a 70mm. I've edited the post above. I also check my equipment insurance list.]
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I finally took the
70mm 75mm el-nikkor for a spin. It had an step ring and one of the Dr. Klaus´s helicoids (an excellent 20 to 40mm) to adapt it to a Nikon body. It does not go to infinity with this set up. Focusing, even with a k3 focusing screen and the lens stopped down to f/8 or f/11 was so difficult that I have to change to live view in order to get anything sharp, will have to keep on practicing. Without farther ado, what I get on the beach
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Summer is better ;D
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Portraits. The focus plane is narrow.
Note, second-eye focus is intentional and I usually don´t like it
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well done! (but you have a 75mm, not 70mm, I had to tell you that before...)
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Yes, 75mm f/1:4, I keep making that mistake...
Thanks Dr Klaus
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Yes, 75mm f/1:4, I keep making that mistake...
Thanks Dr Klaus
Most welcome. There is a 70mm, but a very rare lens that is.
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I recently came by a couple of El-Nikkors: 50mm 2.8 and 70mm 4.
It is there an adapter to an F mount? I tried the 50mm today and it was very nice.
Thanks in advance!
From my experience the 50/2.8 EL Nikkor is a fine lens. I ran off several enlarging lenses, maybe six. I chose 50/3.5 Fujinon-EP but a pair 50/2.8(s), old and new were right there. I own a 75/4.0 EL Nikkor. I'm pretty sure it a simple design with modest performance. I used a 100/5.6 Componon-S in preference to the 75/4.0 whenever possible. I used a Omega Heavy 10x grain focuser.
Dave
[I've edited 70/4.0 to 75/4.0 after check a brochure and insurance list. Thank You! to those who pointed out my error.]
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Thank you for the pointer David. I enjoy taking them out but unfortunally, I have limited time. This days of vacation have been used to try the 75 -some more in the pipeline-, a 28mm f/2 -amazing lens- and to enjoy the 105 2.5 and 10.5 dx 2.8. Four days, four lenses :D Now I´ll have some working days in which I used mostly the zooms and a prime.
Will share here the 50´s images in due time
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El-nikkor 105mm 5.6 at f8 -almost sure- on a d500. Helicoids and adapter ring. Focusing still critical, I needed the help of a tripod, fluid head and live view focusing magnification. That´s a lot of work... :P
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Lovely portraits you've posted, I particularly like the one on the beach, eyes closed, looking up.
I've always been impressed with el-nikkor image quality even though they can be a hassle to use. I was getting my camera serviced at the local Nikon facility and they had the EL-Nikkor 360mm in their display case. Quite the lens to behold.
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Today I tried the el-nikkor 80mm 5.6 with 20 to 40mm helicoids. This combination makes for a comfortable working distances for far and close subjects so I may try it again. As usual focusing through the viewfinder was impossible so any advice will be appreciated. With live view and magnification the very thin focus plane can be used. I like the rendering. One portrait
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Beautiful images are there. But have you ever tried the Rodenstock Apo-Rodagon-N 50/2.8 EL, or any Apo-Sironar, whichever you are able to locate? If you really do, what do you think about, because I, personally, have never tried any of them digitally? Thanks in advance, LZ.
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I guess a replacement focussing screen will help. Great results, esp the #18 white flower and the male portrait in #20
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Beautiful images are there. But have you ever tried the Rodenstock Apo-Rodagon-N 50/2.8 EL, or any Apo-Sironar, whichever you are able to locate? If you really do, what do you think about, because I, personally, have never tried any of them digitally? Thanks in advance, LZ.
I haven´t and I don´t have any of those, sorry. I do own an el-nikkor 50mm 2.8 and it is the next one on the list to try but I´m not sure if you are interested in that one? Will post here
I guess a replacement focussing screen will help. Great results, esp the #18 white flower and the male portrait in #20
Thanks Frank. Slowing down makes for different images.
First try with el-nikkors was with the d700 and k3 split focusing screen with pretty bad results. Had to resort to the liveview for accurate focusing.
I had problems -not so severe- with manual focus with the 105mm 2.5 ai in the same camera so my skills are not good. The green point help a lot with that one but not with any of the el-nikkor so far.
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So, the inability to shoot distant subjects with these EL-Nikkors on Nikon DSLRs is of no problem to me.
+1
Check the tech sheets for the lens and test. A lens not intended for say 2 meters might give a nice rendition in which case you're found a "feature". :)
Dave
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Paco, glad to know you are enjoying the enlarger lenses. EL-Nikkor sounds like Spanish, so it would serve you nicely. :D
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Paco, glad to know you are enjoying the enlarger lenses. EL-Nikkor sounds like Spanish, so it would serve you nicely. :D
EL-Nikkoro then?? :-) Indeed, have always been trusted performers!!
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It does sound Spanish, like an old friend :D
Today was the 50mm 2.8 I have tried this one in the past just didn´t remember. Max focusing distance is very short even with the shorter of the helicoids in my bag. As always, focusing was very difficult. Add today I grab the d300 -I still love that camera- and liveview may not be the best. Some leaves and a everyday-use fisheye.
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Most welcome. There is a 70mm, but a very rare lens that is.
I don't own this lens and it's not listed in the PDF brouchure I have of EL Nikkors. Is there a link with information on the lens? I'm curious about the lens. The lens I own is the common a 75/4.0 EL Nikkor.
Dave
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When I started in darkroom which was about 1972 or 1973 I blindly thought all Schneider lenses were top notch. I believe there were Componar and Componon-S lenses and probably more. I blindly made beginner mistakes and bought Componar lenses who's design dates from about 1914 per Wikipedia.
Again I made mistakes when switching from a 6x6 or 6x7 Durst to a 4x5 Beseler enlarger in 1974. I didn't realize that Nikon had a few economy EL Nikkors so I bought a 50/4.0 and 75/4.0 EL Nikkor. Today with the internet I almost certainly would not have bought the first four enlarging lenses I bought. In the EL-Nikkor line I believe the preferred lens is the 80/5.6 compared to the 75/4.0. I've never owned the 80/5.6 so I can't verify this but the 75/4.0 is a 4 element 3 group design while the 80/5.6 is a 6 element 4 group design like the 105/5.6 and 135/5.6 EL-Nikkors.
Dave
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I don´t know about the inner design but the 80mm 5.6, metal barrel, is the most versatile -with 20 to 40mm helicoids- That young man´s portrait in this page was taken with it. The detail in combination with the d750 I like a lot
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With better information I'd have bought an 85/5.6 EL-Nikkor or 75/3.5 or 4.5? Fuhinon-EP enlarging lens. I'll have to correct the specs on the Fuji lens when I'm at my computer.
The classic advice was don't scimp on your enlarging lenses. When you buy fine taking lenses and then use one economy enlarging lens you loose the primium performance you paid for with the taking lenses, from my experience this is very true.
Dave
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I'm not as sophisticated regarding lens design and performance as many here and I'm self taught so a lot of what I know comes from trial and error. For example I waned a shorter extension tube than a PK-11 for years but over looked the K-Ring set mentioned on Bjørn's legacy Website as old fashioned.
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Just published Thousand and One Nights No.64 - EL-Nikkor 80mm f/5.6N
http://imaging.nikon.com/history/story/0064/index.htm
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I don´t know about the inner design but the 80mm 5.6, metal barrel, is the most versatile -with 20 to 40mm helicoids- That young man´s portrait in this page was taken with it. The detail in combination with the d750 I like a lot
Cannot more than agree, excellent choice the 5.6/80mm is, the older 5.6/105mm being a close 2nd!!
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Thank you for the tale. First one I’ve ever read. They are fantastic 😳
Some useful info with the “Therefore, green to yellow focus positions that humans use for focusing and the violet focus position must all be the same. What's more, good aberration compensation throughout the entire visible spectrum is necessary for color enlargements. As a result, EL-Nikkor lenses were designed with consideration of a broad range of wavelengths, from near ultraviolet at 380 nm to near infrared at 700 nm.” popping out.
My version of the lens it’s the one with metal barrel
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Cannot more than agree, excellent choice the 5.6/80mm is, the older 5.6/105mm being a close 2nd!!
You recomended it. Thanks for the pointer Dr. Klaus. Images in the 105mm/28mm cpu modification were taken with that same lens and adapter
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You recomended it. Thanks for the pointer Dr. Klaus. Images in the 105mm/28mm cpu modification were taken with that same lens and adapter
Most welcome, great you like it!
Wonderful for multispectral work, as the individual images perfectly fit to combine images!
Here my famous "Psychedelic Lily" taken with the 5.6/80mm EL-Nikkor, a UV-VIS composite
(https://nikongear.net/revival/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pbase.com%2Fkds315%2Fimage%2F132136539%2Foriginal.jpg&hash=b937d3acae0fe79ccf37e2e099c4937d6bc338b5)
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That is very interesting. Great results! I have seen some of your work with visible, invisible and combinations but have never seen this specific image.
Thanks for sharing it!
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Cannot more than agree, excellent choice the 5.6/80mm is, the older 5.6/105mm being a close 2nd!!
If I remember correctly, the UV performance of chrome-base 105/5.6 is better than 80/5.6 from the same period: the 105/5.6 shows practically no focus shift in UV.
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I need an uv camera 8)
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I need an uv camera 8)
Easy, ask me...!!
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...my famous "Psychedelic Lily" taken with the 5.6/80mm EL-Nikkor...
I like it!
Dave