Author Topic: Capture NX- D update with color control point  (Read 1071 times)

arthurking83

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2018, 00:05:13 »
Yes of course!
You can choose an older camera raw file and use the newer Picture Control styles in NX-D.
Just tried it on an old D70s NEF file.

My bad for not explaining the implication (late night at work, a bit of brain fade on my part) .. but the implication is that those same Picture Control settings will be also repeated in camera(ie. on the Z cameras).
It seems that not too far into the future, the in camera processing ability won't be too far removed from what's possible on a computer!  :P

Still a bit pissed at Nikon for the lazy-hackabout implementation of film/negative reversal on the D850 too. Why not just make it a Picture Control style, rather than the way they did it(jpg only, and non really configurable).
I remember the 'good ol days' when they put some effort into their customer care and someone made the effort to create Picture Control styles that you could download to the camera(remember the D2XMode .. etc styles).
Arthur

Matthew Currie

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2018, 00:40:07 »
My results with ICE haven't been so bad, though I will say I haven't pixel peeped drastically.  It's been updated a couple of times in the last few years, so it might be worth another try.  I usually try to overlap shots by about 1/3, and I haven't seen any bothersome stitching artifacts.

A recent one, no bothersome seams that I can see:  (e.t.a.  by the way that's Svalbard this summer, and the near part of that glacier is dead owing to global warming)






Akira

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #17 on: September 16, 2018, 01:51:20 »
Matthew, thank you for the additional details.

Even though the last update of ICE to 2.0.3 was in May 2016, it seems to be quite a bit improved from the version I tried. 

I've download the 2.0.3.  Your image makes me feel that it is worth giving it another try.  It even supports RAW files using Microsoft's own converter now.
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ericbowles

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2018, 14:07:41 »
It's great to see Control Points in NX-D.  They are a very useful feature.

One of the concerns mentioned here was about the impact of control points on faces.  One of the key features of control points is you can use "neutral" control points with no changes to eliminate spillover to areas that are nearby.  You can also right click and duplicate a control point and might use 3-4 small control points rather than one large control point.

Nikon was a part owner of Nik when Capture NX2 was released with control points and the Nik plugins.  CNX2 had a trademark for Upoint by Nik, but did not explicitly indicate who owned the idea for local adjustments using control points.  Around 2008 Nikon stopped investing in enhancements from Nik, and this ultimately led to Nikon discontinuing their relationship and ownership of Nik.  CNX2 was going to need a complete rewrite to move forward and Nikon was unwilling to make that investment in 2008-2010.  It was several years before Nik developed and released Snapseed - which is what Google really wanted.  The Nik staff stayed with Google for a year or less fulfilling their contractual requirements, but it was obvious Google did not want to invest in software development outside of Snapseed.  Some of the original developers are now at Skylum/Luminar.  All this is to say that control points may not be that unique and Nikon could easily have retained rights or been able to acquire rights if needed since DxO appears to need money. 


Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #19 on: September 16, 2018, 14:22:39 »
One of the concerns mentioned here was about the impact of control points on faces.  One of the key features of control points is you can use "neutral" control points with no changes to eliminate spillover to areas that are nearby.  You can also right click and duplicate a control point and might use 3-4 small control points rather than one large control point.

I understand, but I want the adjustment to extend to the whole face including the dark areas, the eyes, nose etc. The color control point applies adjustment to areas of similar tone and colour but the eyes are not the same colour or tone than the cheeks, so it doesn't work.

Using the selection brush tool in NX2, this facial selection takes a couple of seconds and is the quickest way of fixing underexposed faces in shots. With PS it took me 15 min to get it done the first time around (tinkering with the mask) somehow it was almost magically easy in NX2. Of course now I can do it faster in PS but it's still a much slower process to get that kind of control as NX2 allowed so easily. And in my opinion somehow the adjustments in NX2 didn't bring out as much noise as ACR does when doing this. But this is only my recollection maybe someone else can do it better.

One area where color control points are great is when shooting with a white background and needing to adjust the areas of the background behind the subject to be closer to white. With color control points it is a very quick task.

paul_k

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Re: Capture NX- D update with color control point
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2018, 12:06:23 »
I was pretty happy to hear about the new NXD version with colourpoints, as, since I didn't want to say goodbye to NX2 after I got a D850, I up till then shot TIFF's rather then NEF's to be able to process my D850 images in NX2
While that was doable, I didn't feel (not a 'scientific' proof or conclusion) that I was getting the best end result doing so

So I finally upgraded my Macbook OS from 10.8 to 10.13.6 (had kept using the old OS since NX2 reportedly couldn't/wouldn't run on any latest versions OS) and installed High Sierra
The OS upgrade went smoothly without any hiccups, and when I was finished and restarted the system, I was happy to discover my old NX2.4.6 continued fully working despite the new OS, after which I installed NX D 15.0

My findings so far
- NX D 1.5.0 is more prone to crashing when using a lot of the Retouching options, and switching fast between them
Maybe my bad, but in NX2 I could easily switch between eg retrieving Highlights and/or Shadows, changing Exposure, Contrast and Saturation, and using multiple (10+) Colorpoints all the time without any problems. In NX D 1.5.0 I have to do so much more carefully, and at a much more leisurely speed, or it will shut down/crash
- On the positive side, the Color points in NXD work as advertised, although I up till now have more problems to apply them in extreme small area's compared to the 'old' ones in NX2
- As NXD works with side cars, I can't save copies of a processed NEF together with a copy of the original unedited NEF
Also, if I, intentionally or by accident, at a later moment, while eg tentatively playing around, click the option to return to the original settings at the moment when the image was taken, all my actions/modifications until then in the 'original file' are irretrievably deleted, and I am forced to start all over again from zero to return to the final 'modified' version
Only work around is to make a extra copy of the processed NEF in a separate folder, and use that as a 'don't touch but make a copy if somewhere in future you want to play around with it ' file
- NX 1.5.0 is in my experience slower with processing any modifications I make while processing a D850 NEF compared to a D850 TIFF in NX2. When eg applying modifications with a Color Point in NX D, I, while I can see the modification in the Navigator preview (which while does give a close up when eg zooming in, but unfortunately can not be enlarged to a larger sized image) have to wait some time before the result show in the full size preview I'm working on
- When I am done playing around with a NEF and want to convert it to a TIFF of JPG in NXD, this also takes a lot more time than I'm used to when doing so in NX2.
When I'm finished doing so while using the designated option, I don't immediately get a TIFF or JPG
Instead I get a 'document' with a non related to the original NEF name I can't open or preview, which only after a minute or so appears as the intended modified TIF or NEF 
In NX2 this conversion is next to immediate (MacBook Pro i7 16GB memory 750+ GB SSD)
- IN NX2 it was possible to only very locally apply any sharpening, eg when only 'sharpening' an eye/the eyes in a portrait, by using Control Points in combination with the 'Unsharp Mask' tool
That option however seems to be lost/deleted in NXD 1.5.0
- Finally I at least for me important difference
In NX2 I can convert a file into B/W with the B/W filter options, which also allows modifying the result by, apart from Exposure and Contrast, varying the impact of color settings from eg green, yellow, blue and red, similar to using filters of those colors when shooting B/W film
In NX 1.5.0 that is no longer possible, I can only use/only have the B/W option in the Picture Control menu, which lacks the afore mentioned 'color filter' option
Maybe not a biggie for many, but at least for me it is

So bit of a mixed bag for me
I'm happy to be able to shoot NEF's with my D850 I can process in NX D 1.5.0
On the other hand I do miss the stability, speed and some of the above mentioned options of NX2
As however I find that despite/contrary many user reports NX2 keeps working under High Sierra, I'm equally happy I can still keep using NX2 for processing my D800, DF and D7100 NEF's, and also, if I want to, make some of the above mentioned modifications in converted D850 Tiff's and JPG's