GAS ... SONY A7RII

[tommiejeep]

Yup, your 12MP sensor becomes a +  .  Interesting comment by Sony that they will see if the demand is there for compressed.  Maybe they are betting that the family shooters will not like the large files and do not try and pull as much from the images so were happy as was.  I really cannot afford to take a flier on the a7RII and do not care about 4K Vids.   I'll see if the Firmware filters down and prices to drop.  No rush.
Tom

[Jan Anne]

The prices for the new Sony's are a bit insane indeed, the a7R used to be €2100 at launch day but the MKII is €3500 which is more in line with the Nikon and Canon offerings but compared to the MKI model the price went up 67%

[tommiejeep]

Definitely getting into the same price range as the higher end DSLRs but also starting to close the gap size-wise .  Compared to the D750 , a gripped a7RII is right there on  weight , then lens dependent.  Big deal is that no matter what anyone says , take away 4K vids, The D3S and D750 will shoot anything I want to shoot.  At this point the Sony cannot.   No one is fooled into thinking the Sony a7xx series can compete for fast action (or even medium fast with no change of direction) .  For sure, no camera is perfect for all types of shooting.

There are several very attractive/interesting features , opening up a world of lenses being the most attractive to me.  IBIS for all lenses, cool  .     Adapters seem to be getting better and will probably continue to do so.

I am also sure the a7xx can replace my EM1 but, by how much improvement (obviously high iso and resolution) ?  There are a few things about the controls and menu that need to be worked out.   I had/have similar problems with Olympus menu but at least I can move the focus point/pts quickly in one step  .

I will continue to watch closely      I'm still thinking an A7RIII and a7III will be out in less than a year  .  Really depends on what Sony can or cannot do with Firmware and a perceived marketing choice to replace rather than correct/improve.    I will get one but comes down to a cost benefit analysis and doesn't work yet 
Tom

[JJChan]

Tom
The A7II is pretty cheap in Aus right now as there is a $300 refund. I think I'm going to bite the bullet this weekend.

The big problem in Australia is expense of hiring to find out if it works - to that end, I spent a couple of hours in the store and really annoyed the salesman - but I could not get any feel of how the focus peaking was going to work for me. I brought in my noct and 25-50 but there weren't any adapters available without me buying one as well so I played with focus peaking on the Zeiss 55 1.8.

I'm pretty sure it won't replace the Df or D800E for me but may give new IBIS full frame liife to Takumars, Helios and old fast Nikon glass....

[tommiejeep]

Hi JJ, sounds a good deal.  My dealer keeps saying that he will give me a better price but will not tell me exactly the price until I tell him what lenses I will be getting with the camera.  My wife flies to the UK next month and used a7IIs are starting to pop up with very low shutter counts ( many selling to fund their GAS, a7RII  ) . 

 A couple of Df shooters that I keep in touch with tell me the a7RII is better in several important ways and to wait until the price drops.  My Nikons are not going anywhere but the Df/a7xx could be a very nice combo using the MF Nikons on the Df and others on the a7xx,

Let me (us) know what you think of the camera when you start using it.  My wife will be in UK 20-28 Oct so if a great deal popped up.... 
Cheers,

[Bill Mellen]

My good friend Howard allowed me to handle and play with his A7RII.  All I can say is that your lust and desires are somewhat justified ....

It is a much nicer camera than his ancient (two year old) A7R which is uncomfortable for me to hold without the battery grip.  The A7RII is a much more natural fit for me. 

Pictures with the 55mm f/1.8 are simply stunning on both as are images with his new Zeiss 25mm f/2 Batis lens.

It was a pleasure to handle these wonderful technical Tour De Force cameras and lenses.  I will have to do with my lowly Nikons until I come into some money that I don't know about.

Now if they could only fix their Sony Digital Video Recorder menus and buttons that are baffling to just about everyone.

[Frank Fremerey]

Thank you Bill.
We all are capable to take pictures with any cam.
But we tend to take cameras personally.
Your impression caters to our desire.

[tommiejeep]

Bill, I'm in the same boat  ,  ,  Just a hefty buy-in for yet another system and a new system will certainly not improve my skills    .   

I found this interesting:
http://blog.mingthein.com/2015/09/12/a-visit-to-zeiss-and-thoughts-on-the-milvus-line/
Not just the article about Zeiss but reading through the comments.   Ming seems to have the same concerns about Sony's commitment to their camera division .

I'm now thinking about a cheaper 'buy-in' with a body(a7II most likely) and one or two native lenses and a Nikon F adapter .  Then wait and see.  Funny, the 55 1.8 and Batis 25 f2 are the most probable.  The 90 2.8 is tempting but one of my internet friends went through 3 copies before being satisfied.  I do not have the luxury of trying several copies of lenses.  I have a raft of portrait lenses for Nikon.
Cheers,
Tom

[JJChan]

Tom - I did exactly that.
My A7II finally turned up but I did manage to get a pretty good deal - about US$1050 in the end after rebates and extra $100 off eBay. I also splashed out and got the Sony 28mm f2 and 90mmf2.8 also well discounted. I use the Novoflex adapter.

It has taken a few days to get used to the myriad of settings but in a nutshell:- it is a lovely camera to hold and use echoing Bill's experience with the A7RII. More importantly for me, the focus peaking and magnification means that it is EXCEPTIONALLY easy to use manual focus lenses and even f1.2 is accurate and very sharp. The IBIS is crazy even 1/5sec seem pretty sharp on 58mm lens! I'm wishing for weekends to get out there and shoot.

A handful of early issues: I still haven't got a hang of processing the files. Nikon files still look crisper and cleaner using Capture NX2. I'm rapidly learning Capture One Express (comes free with Sony) as Lightroom files look dull. There are many many settings - some incomprehensible eg FEL hold vs FEL toggle (what's FEL? Whats hold vs toggle?) It also really chews through the battery.

Overall, I'm rather glad to have got it. I would certainly give it a go. The buy in with the A7II was not too bad, but being able to use all Nikon MF lenses with rapid and very accurate focus is a massive advantage that I really was not aware of. Most of my Nikon glass is MF and it has really brought new life to them.

Cheers JJ

[Frank Fremerey]

JJChan: Thank you very much. Yes it might be a great idea to enter a system via a cheap deal & package. That way you do not loose a lot if you leave later.

But this does not seem to be the case with you anytime soon.

"New life to your MF Nikkors" for 1050 US$ that is the real deal.

Here in Germany the price for body only is between 1.600 and 1.800 Euros and I sure like to have some decent native glass like the 1.8/55mm Sonnar

[Jan Anne]

A handful of early issues: I still haven't got a hang of processing the files. Nikon files still look crisper and cleaner using Capture NX2. I'm rapidly learning Capture One Express (comes free with Sony) as Lightroom files look dull.

Nikon RAW files look crisp in CNX2 because they are shown with the secret Nikon JPG sauce the other RAW editors can't read out but only guesstimate. With the Sony RAW files this works the same, when using Sony's Image Data Convertor the RAW files look exactly the same as the baked JPGs and they look flat and dull in other editors.

In the early stage I converted the Sony RAW files with IDC to a TIFF and processed them with CNX2 because CNX2 was the only I knew 

Now I'm using a Capture One Pro for Sony which also supports local adjustments (the free version doesn't), I'm not at the same level as with CNX2 yet but I'm learning quickly.

[tommiejeep]

Tom - I did exactly that.
My A7II finally turned up but I did manage to get a pretty good deal - about US$1050 in the end after rebates and extra $100 off eBay. I also splashed out and got the Sony 28mm f2 and 90mmf2.8 also well discounted. I use the Novoflex adapter.



JJ , that is a much better price than I have been able to find.  I tried to find one while there was a 10% PayPal discount on eBay UK but no luck.  Best I can do so far is the a7II for $1500 with 2 year Sony India warranty.  I've ordered the Novoflex (the one with the blue stripe that Jan did not like).  I will get the grip since the bodies are just too small.  I use the grip on the EM1 90% of the time.

It has taken a few days to get used to the myriad of settings but in a nutshell:- it is a lovely camera to hold and use echoing Bill's experience with the A7RII. More importantly for me, the focus peaking and magnification means that it is EXCEPTIONALLY easy to use manual focus lenses and even f1.2 is accurate and very sharp. The IBIS is crazy even 1/5sec seem pretty sharp on 58mm lens! I'm wishing for weekends to get out there and shoot.

The Sony UI scares me to death  . I even thought about getting an a6000 (super cheap) just to start learning the menu/settings.  I am still confused as to lenses since I have a small collection of Nikon Ai-s and Ai lenses.  Many are in the 105/135 mm range with a few wides.  I did pick up the Loxia 50 f2.  For some one that shoots mostly action , I've started using MF more than I ever expected.   I may just get one native AF lens to start with.  I will not do much about lenses until we see the announcement that is coming.  An 85 1.2 would be sweet ,  hate to pay the money for the Batis 85 1.8 if a 1.2 is on the way.

A handful of early issues: I still haven't got a hang of processing the files. Nikon files still look crisper and cleaner using Capture NX2. I'm rapidly learning Capture One Express (comes free with Sony) as Lightroom files look dull. There are many many settings - some incomprehensible eg FEL hold vs FEL toggle (what's FEL? Whats hold vs toggle?) It also really chews through the battery.

My collection of programs for PP is getting too large.  I still use CNX2 for all of the older Nikons but am slowly learning to use ACR/PS for the D750/EM1.  I guess I will have to give Capture One Pro a try.

Overall, I'm rather glad to have got it. I would certainly give it a go. The buy in with the A7II was not too bad, but being able to use all Nikon MF lenses with rapid and very accurate focus is a massive advantage that I really was not aware of. Most of my Nikon glass is MF and it has really brought new life to them.

My primary reason for getting a Sony    IBIS , with good MF lenses , is jut too tempting (the reason I will be going with the a7II vs a7R .  Sony needs to come out with a Df version sans Vids  or eve better, Nikon brings out a mirrorless Df with 399 focus points and F mount compatible !

Cheers JJ

Congrats and all the best with your adventure,  I will be joining you at some point.
Tom

Well, I am getting a little better with 'Quote'   .   I am also getting a couple of Leica adapters and looking at some old lenses, an CV 75 2.5 Color Heliar (LTM) and a 90 f3.5 Lanthar (LTM).  The prices drop significantly when not trying to find the lenses in a Nikon Ai-s mount 
Tom

[JJChan]

Nikon RAW files look crisp in CNX2 because they are shown with the secret Nikon JPG sauce the other RAW editors can't read out but only guesstimate. With the Sony RAW files this works the same, when using Sony's Image Data Convertor the RAW files look exactly the same as the baked JPGs and they look flat and dull in other editors.

In the early stage I converted the Sony RAW files with IDC to a TIFF and processed them with CNX2 because CNX2 was the only I knew 

Now I'm using a Capture One Pro for Sony which also supports local adjustments (the free version doesn't), I'm not at the same level as with CNX2 yet but I'm learning quickly.

Jan
Thanks for the tip! I've just downloaded IDC. I will probably go back to CNX2 for TIFF alignment and cropping as it is just familiar and easy.

[JJChan]

Well, I am getting a little better with 'Quote'   .   I am also getting a couple of Leica adapters and looking at some old lenses, an CV 75 2.5 Color Heliar (LTM) and a 90 f3.5 Lanthar (LTM).  The prices drop significantly when not trying to find the lenses in a Nikon Ai-s mount 
Tom

Tom
Good luck! It is actually getting very fun! An M42 adapter turned up today and Takumar 50mm 1.4 is really as good as it seemed to be on my dad's Spotmatic II and velvia when I was in Beijing just after Tiananmen in the early 90s.

I've got quite a few lenses in the 105-150 range - very easy to use but processing still needs work and do not look as spectacular as from Df with same lenses. Because of this, I'm off to Brisbane this weekend (it's a 6 hr flight - Australia is BIG) and I'm bringing my Df with Zeiss 28 and Voigt 180mm and leaving the Sony at home.

Good times!

JJ

[tommiejeep]

JJ, the Df just produces my very favourite files.  So easy to work with 

I just reclaimed my 180 2.8D from my daughter,  Not the same as your Voigt 180.  Gave her the 70-200 2.8vrI in exchange.

I think Sony is now pushing High Octane GAS , the Variable Low Pass on the RX1RII probably means another camera by spring 
Yup, Oz is very big.  Years ago I was staying with friends in Melbourne and another friend said "why don't you pop over to Perth for a couple of days" , right 
Tom