NikonGear'23

Gear Talk => Other => Topic started by: Michael Erlewine on February 23, 2021, 17:24:00

Title: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 23, 2021, 17:24:00
LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy

It threatens spring here, eventually, and with the advancing light each day, I want to get out in the woods, but I am getting old and can’t (or don’t want to) carry heavy equipment.

I would like suggestions on the lightest carbon-fiber tripod, the lightest locking head (not ball heads), and of course some kind of Arca clamp.

Right now, the best I have is a Gitzo G 1228 Tripod, the Arca-Swiss Monoball PO, and an Arca (tiny-thin) clamp, with a total weight of this system (minus a camera) is 4.187 lbs. (1.899 KG).

Any suggestions welcome. Don’t bother with ball-head suggestions. I have plenty and don’t use them. I also have the Burzynski ball-head (which does lock), but that is too heavy for this project. This project being getting me in the field.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: MEPER on February 23, 2021, 18:56:54
Could it be something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/AOKA-Compact-Lightweight-Capacity-Travelling/dp/B07PJ6RTHX

......they all seems to have kind of mini-ball head. If Arca clamp is a requirement and it must not be a small ball head?
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 23, 2021, 19:02:52
Could it be something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/AOKA-Compact-Lightweight-Capacity-Travelling/dp/B07PJ6RTHX

......they all seems to have kind of mini-ball head. If Arca clamp is a requirement and it must not be a small ball head?

That tripod is only 15" high. I need at least 60".... and the ability to screw on whatever non-ball head I want to use.

THanks
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: MEPER on February 23, 2021, 19:32:39
Ok.....Gitzo makes a traveler like this:
https://www.gitzo.com/us-en/tripod-traveler-series-1-4-sections-gt1545tus/

....it goes to just above 60" with column up.....probably difficult to find something lighter......
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Akira on February 23, 2021, 19:45:00
What do you mean by "locking head"?  I cannot think of any kind of head lighter than those of ballhead type.  Also, could you specify the heaviest (or the most demanding) possible camera/lens combo you would mount on the system you are looking for?

The Gitzo GT1545TUS MEPER recommends (2.33 lbs) and Acratech GPSS ballhead (0.85 lbs) makes a total of 3.18 lbs kit.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: pluton on February 23, 2021, 19:50:34
The lightest Gitzo Series 2 3-way pan head (with your own added Arca clamp) would probably be a good match for this lightweight Traveler pod. No good for long lenses or high winds, of course.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 23, 2021, 19:58:47
What do you mean by "locking head"?  I cannot think of any kind of head lighter than those of ballhead type.  Also, could you specify the heaviest (or the most demanding) possible camera/lens combo you would mount on the system you are looking for?

The Gitzo GT1545TUS MEPER recommends (2.33 lbs) and Acratech GPSS ballhead (0.85 lbs) makes a total of 3.18 lbs kit.

Yes, the Gitzo GT1545T tripod seems to be the lightest tripo that I would consider using. As for heads, I say NO ball heads please, light or not. Don't use them or than the Burzynsk, which I do us, but it is heavy. I have all kinds of ball heads, but they all sag or not "lock" where I want them to.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Akira on February 23, 2021, 20:22:38
Yes, the Gitzo GT1545T tripod seems to be the lightest tripo that I would consider using. As for heads, I say NO ball heads please, light or not. Don't use them or than the Burzynsk, which I do us, but it is heavy. I have all kinds of ball heads, but they all sag or not "lock" where I want them to.

Thank you for the clarification.  But any heavier head on a light tripod like GT1545T should make an unstable, top-heavy combo, and it could be challenging to frame, because the whole rig will be wobbling during the framing and focusing.

The series 2 pan/tilt head Keith recommends can be nice but is almost twice as heavy as your A-S P0.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 23, 2021, 20:58:35
Thank you for the clarification.  But any heavier head on a light tripod like GT1545T should make an unstable, top-heavy combo, and it could be challenging to frame, because the whole rig will be wobbling during the framing and focusing.

The series 2 pan/tilt head Keith recommends can be nice but is almost twice as heavy as your A-S P0.

The Arca-Swiss Monoball PO is not too heavy or bulky, I don't plan to do much focus-stacking in the field, so it will do. I can always take one of my geared-heads, which is what I prefer.

Now, for lenses. I told myself that with all the lenses I have, I can get used to using the FTZ adapter, but as I should of guessed, I would rather use the new S lenses. Now, any idea for lenses? I have the 70-200 s, but that is heavy. I don't care much for the 24-70, f/4 lens yet I keep taking great pictures with it. Go figure, as they say. I might use that.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Snoogly on February 23, 2021, 21:13:14
Take a look at the Punks Corey

https://www.3leggedthing.com/corey

A review
https://youtu.be/CypJgqd-uWk

It’s hard not to like!
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Ashlandish on February 23, 2021, 21:16:51
The Center Column might be a good resource: https://thecentercolumn.com.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 24, 2021, 02:22:14
I hear you. Thanks.

I have a number of RSS tripods.

For this use, I feel the Gitzo GIGT1545T Carbon Fiber Traveler Series 1
60.2” (8.6’)
Weight  2.34 lb

Is less expensive and will do the job, with the Arca PO Monoball (which locks) and an Arca-Swiss Clamp.

I picked up Gitzo GIGT1545T for $400, used. I won't use the center column, but just the short column.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Erik Lund on February 24, 2021, 10:53:46
For ultra light tripods it's super difficult to find a rigid solution.
I guess the weight issue is during transport therefore I suggest looking into how to transport the tripod in an ergonomic way, an appropriately padded strap for instance.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 24, 2021, 11:11:30
For ultra light tripods it's super difficult to find a rigid solution.
I guess the weight issue is during transport therefore I suggest looking into how to transport the tripod in an ergonomic way, an appropriately padded strap for instance.

I understand. I have looked around and the Really Right Stuff TFC-14 MK2 Series1 Ultralight Carbon Fiber Tripod (47.2"), which weighs 2.47 lb / 1.12 kg is about the best I see. Even that has four sections, and I like three sections. It is expensive and I don't like that.

I have bought, but not received a copy of the Gitzo GIGT1545T Carbon Fiber Traveler Series 1
60.2” (8.6’) Weight  2.34 lb. It is four sections and probably not very sturdy. On that I might try the Ara-Swiss Monoball PO. I don't like the feel of it, but it is not too heavy and not bulky.

I see that these new mirrorless cameras have in-camera stabilization, but I feel that is laziness for my work. I like a sturdy tripod, a geared head (Cube), and so on. At the same time, since I am going to be 80 this year, I don't like to haul heavy equipment far... as I used to do. Your idea is a good one, make the hauling of heavier but more sturdy equipment less arduous by distributing the weight or buffering it somehow. No doubt I will try that.

In the meantime, I will play with these more spindly setups and see how that works out. And I am amazed at how good some of the new iPhone photos can be. For illustrative work, they are perfect to haul around. For my kind of photography, not so much.

All of this is just me fidgeting before the coming of spring. Meanwhile, I am all out of plants and it keeps snowing here... a lot.

So, I do still life... some. THis is the Nikon Z7 II with the Nikon Noct95 lens.



Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Erik Lund on February 24, 2021, 11:27:19
Looking forward to your findings!When I evaluate a tripod I extend the legs fully, then I do a check of how flexible the setup is by grabbing the top and bend and or twist it, then collapse the leg sections gradually by an inch and repeat the test, it's quite obvious to feel the difference as to how much you need to collapse the legs to obtain more stability or rigidity, often collapsing a leg section an inch helps a lot.
Yes most three leg section solutions are more stable than four. Same goes for column extension if the tripod has a column.
I then mark the legs for maximum extended stabile height use.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 24, 2021, 11:33:25
Looking forward to your findings!When I evaluate a tripod I extend the legs fully, then I do a check of how flexible the setup is by grabbing the top and bend and or twist it, then collapse the leg sections gradually by an inch and repeat the test, it's quite obvious to feel the difference as to how much you need to collapse the legs to obtain more stability or rigidity, often collapsing a leg section an inch helps a lot.
Yes most three leg section solutions are more stable than four. Same goes for column extension if the tripod has a column.
I then mark the legs for maximum extended stabile height use.

Makes sense. I have a whole box of columns sitting around. I never use them because, no matter how useful they may seem, the moment I go vertical from where the tripod legs meet, I pay an immediate price in stability. Sure, I could inch it out, as you suggest, but for me I might as well bite the bullet and extend or retract the legs and maintain whatever stability is there. I am not talking about your test, but only if I apply that to columns. I try to stay away from columns and more than three sections to a tripod leg.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: chris dees on February 24, 2021, 12:31:18
I use an old Gitso GT1540T (2007). I removed the centre column and replaced it with a base plate (Kirk FP-100).
Together with a RRS BH-40 ballhead and Arca Swiss clamp it's 55".
I don't find it very sturdy, but when I don't extend the smallest/last feet, it's ok.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 24, 2021, 13:59:08
Does anyone have a recommendation for particular brand or kind of tripod strap?
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Erik Lund on February 24, 2021, 14:21:03
Gitzo makes a nice on I use, it's a bit stiff but works quite well with their larger tripods.
For smaller tripod PeakDesign camerastraps works fine with their easy snap on / off ability.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: MFloyd on February 24, 2021, 18:39:54
I’m using this one from RRS:

(https://www.reallyrightstuff.com/images/products/mk2-qdss.Grey%20Strap_Series%204_03.png?resizeid=9&resizeh=600&resizew=600)

https://www.reallyrightstuff.com/mk2-qdss

Straps and Quick Detachment fixations come originally from the military (Magpul). It takes about 200 kgf to rip these apart:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50627878903_f8e1786ac5_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2k8P7xR)
_8524083.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2k8P7xR)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50628753162_474479e9b9_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2k8TArh)
_8524083.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2k8TArh)


Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: ColinM on February 24, 2021, 21:45:56
Its probably too late now Michael, but as a lateral thinking solution, have you considered just hiring an apprentice?

Hiring would allow you full control over who accompanied you
(since I expect several people would be prepared to pay *you* for a chance like this)

Just a thought....
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on February 24, 2021, 22:15:22
Its probably too late now Michael, but as a lateral thinking solution, have you considered just hiring an apprentice?
  • You could then have *any* equipment carried to the locations you want to explore
  • If you wished, you could pass on some of your extensive knowledge & experience.
    win:win

Hiring would allow you full control over who accompanied you
(since I expect several people would be prepared to pay *you* for a chance like this)

Just a thought....

LOL. That's a good one. I never thought of that. I think not, since I like to be alone and wander in the forests, streams, and meadows, and I can take a long time just doing nothing at all. I would drive a helper crazy or be driven so.

Meanwhile, I am making progress putting gear together. It won't be the most expensive, but what I consider good enough for the work I do. I will try to post here the kit, as I finally decide what is best. Thanks for the input everyone!
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on March 01, 2021, 20:28:26
OK. Here is my first pass on a light field system. It totals out at 5.42 lbs. (2461.3 g). Of course, I may switch things around, but this light enough to travel some distance and not have my body complain.

LIGHT FIELD SYSTEM

11.82 oz (335 g) Laowa 65mm f/2.8 2x Ultra Macro APO - Nikon Z
22.40 oz (635 g) Nikon Z7 II
12.69 oz (359.7 g) LEOFOTO G2 Geared 3D
02.47 oz (70 g) Arca-Swiss Clamp
37.44 oz (2.34 lb, 1061.4 g) Gitzo GIGT1545T Carbon 60.2” (8.6’)

TOTAL+
86.82 0z (5.42 lbs 2461.3 g)
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Michael Erlewine on March 07, 2021, 18:14:59
hecking out the lightest carbon tripod I could find, the Oben CTT-1000L Carbon Fiber Tripod and head, using their tiny head (which is actually very nice), the Nikon Z7 II and the Laowa 65mm lens, weighs in at about 51.82 = 3.20 lbs 

However, the bottom line for me is that although very well made, that Oben tripod is too spindly for my use. It also is not high enough, unless you put on the center column which is not a center column that passes through the top of the tripod plate, but one that screws directly on top of the tripod base, a total no-no for me. I hate columns, but might use an internal one to raise just a few inches. Mostly, I don’t touch columns and store them in a box somewhere, where they have company.

I do like the tiny ball head, which has a carefully numbered (but small) pan base and along with an Arca plate, weighs only 5.3 oz. I am going to keep the tiny tripod and use it for holding diffusers, and use the tripod head when I don’t want to use the Leofoto G2 small geared head in the field, for shots that need more angle, etc. I will carry the small head in my messenger bag in case I need it and swap it out (via Arca plate) with the geared Leofoto G2.


Tiny Head 5.3 Oz  (150.3 g) includes ARCA plate
15.4 OZ (436.6) Oben TRIPOD AND Arca CLAMP

SYSTEM WITH NON GEARED HEAD

15.4 oz (436.58 g) Oben CTT-1000L Carbon Fiber Tripod and ball head
11.82 oz (335 g) Laowa 65mm f/2.8 2x Ultra Macro APO - Nikon Z
22.40 oz (635 g) Nikon Z7 II
49.62 OZ  = 3.20 lbs (1406.7 G)


SYSTEM WITH GEARED HEAD

11.82 oz (335 g) Laowa 65mm f/2.8 2x Ultra Macro APO - Nikon Z
22.40 oz (635 g) Nikon Z7 II
12.69 oz (359.7 g) LEOFOTO G2 Geared 3D
02.47 oz (70 g) Arca-Swiss Clamp
17.60 oz (498.95 g) Oben CTT-1000L Carbon Fiber Tripod and head
66.98 oz = 4.18 lbs
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: dickb on June 03, 2021, 17:07:54
I'm a bit late in finding this thread, but my take on such a system would be the FEISOL Tournament Tripod CT-3342 Rapid instead of the Gitzo. I have the CT-3442 myself, the four section variant that is a bit shorter in transport size, but if I were to buy one now I'd trade the smaller size for the higher rigidity of the three section version. I really like the lack of centre column, I use the flat disc option (there is a centre column available but like yours, mine lives in its box). It can also be exchanged for a levelling base. For ultimate light weight I sometimes use the Novoflex MagicBalance, but that might be too close to a ballhead for you.

Is the Leofoto geared head something you would recommend? I have a Manfrotto 410 but that is more than double the weight.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: MILLIREHM on June 05, 2021, 21:22:12
For my needs I found the FEISOL Tournament Tripod CT-3442 Rapid to be the best lightweight and compact tripod solution. It proved to be significantly better in any aspect than the Gitzo 1228 which I was using for this purpose before (and was twice as expensive). I am using it together with the Markins Q3Emille Ballhead that is small enough to use the Tournament function. No experience with the 3342 but if compactness is no priority I am sure this is the more stable solution - in this case tournament Function is not important as well and a less compact head might be advantageous.

Never heard about the Leofoto geared head so far - very interesting though
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: dickb on June 06, 2021, 12:53:04
For my needs I found the FEISOL Tournament Tripod CT-3442 Rapid to be the best lightweight and compact tripod solution. It proved to be significantly better in any aspect than the Gitzo 1228 which I was using for this purpose before (and was twice as expensive). I am using it together with the Markins Q3Emille Ballhead that is small enough to use the Tournament function. No experience with the 3342 but if compactness is no priority I am sure this is the more stable solution - in this case tournament Function is not important as well and a less compact head might be advantageous.

By Tournament function, do you mean the option of flipping the legs past their locking surfaces, vertically along the ball head, intended for compact transport?

I often use the tripod upside-down, with the ball head and camera between the flipped legs. This allows you to have the camera at ground level and just above, unlike any solution where the tripod or mounting system is between the camera and the ground. Very useful for delicate subjects like dewdrops on mossy terrain, you can get extremely close without disturbing it. Drawbacks are the lack of locking option for the legs, not a big deal in my experience, the annoyance of having to work the three tripod legs, and having to operate the camera upside-down. To fix that final problem I use a camera cage with an added arca swiss quick release plate on top of the camera, so I can use my camera in its normal orientation.

If the lack of leg-locking-option is a problem, I suppose you could flip the flat disc and mount the camera upside-down that way. The small grub screws that hold the disc are a bit finnicky though, perhaps if you replace those with wing nut alternatives it is more practical.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Steven Paulsen on June 10, 2021, 19:11:29
I understand what you are looking for. ( Is there any suggestions for a portable stool?) For flower macros, I usually get a wet bottom and knees. I would not schlep the monster anywhere far, but a series 5 is only a bit north of 6lb. It fits perfectly into a $30 ukulele gig bag with shoulder straps. I can use a leg to help myself get up, after playing in the mud. I bought a gitzo 1227/cf, with a B1/screw clamp and found it quite top heavy. (A gripped body or pro style, with lens.)


If you are shooting a 65mm lens on a very light body,.....if it suites your expectations, you got the gold.
<humor>
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: MILLIREHM on June 14, 2021, 23:54:33
By Tournament function, do you mean the option of flipping the legs past their locking surfaces, vertically along the ball head, intended for compact transport?

I often use the tripod upside-down, with the ball head and camera between the flipped legs. This allows you to have the camera at ground level and just above, unlike any solution where the tripod or mounting system is between the camera and the ground. Very useful for delicate subjects like dewdrops on mossy terrain, you can get extremely close without disturbing it. Drawbacks are the lack of locking option for the legs, not a big deal in my experience, the annoyance of having to work the three tripod legs, and having to operate the camera upside-down. To fix that final problem I use a camera cage with an added arca swiss quick release plate on top of the camera, so I can use my camera in its normal orientation.

If the lack of leg-locking-option is a problem, I suppose you could flip the flat disc and mount the camera upside-down that way. The small grub screws that hold the disc are a bit finnicky though, perhaps if you replace those with wing nut alternatives it is more practical.

yes, thats what the "tournament" stands for. So far i never used it the way you described, but i can place the tripod in zero distance above ground, sothe camera height is determined by the tripod heads height. Always wondered why there are so many tripod models with a center column btw-
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: dickb on June 15, 2021, 12:51:42
yes, thats what the "tournament" stands for.


That's news to me - Feisol tripods from other ranges, the Elite for instance, also have this function, they call it "180° Flip-Legs". So I understood it to mean that Tournament is just the name for a series of tripods that happen to include that option. Not that this matters in any meaningful way, what's in a name.

Quote from: MILLIREHM
So far i never used it the way you described, but i can place the tripod in zero distance above ground, sothe camera height is determined by the tripod heads height.

Well, there is always the thickness of the tripod plate itself, plus like you say the the tripod head hight. If that is low enough for what you do, great. The stability of the tripod when used this way is not optimal, with the tripod legs at a slight angle the whole is more stable. Also the legs spread out flat can interfere more with what you are trying to photograph.

Quote from: MILLIREHM
Always wondered why there are so many tripod models with a center column btw-

Indeed, every design is a compromise, but why the inclusion of a centre column (more weight, less stability, more convenience) is so popular is somewhat surprising to me as well.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Wannabebetter on June 30, 2021, 16:22:34
I was wondering, is it just me? Then I put my own tripod on the bathroom scale. My Bogen 3233 legs, topped with a 3063 pan-and-tilt head, weighs-in at exactly 10lbs. I don't know if I'm relieved that "it's not me" or concerned that "it is me", so far as the weight goes. I'm heartened to know, I can still pack this beast on my "expeditions". And given fair warning, it's neigh time I acquired something practically light if ever I plan on actually going somewhere.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Birna Rørslett on June 30, 2021, 16:27:50
My usual "travel" tripod is a Sachtler with Burzynsky head. It weighs in at 2.7kg of which the head probably is half the weight. It easily supports lenses up to 600mm.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: golunvolo on June 30, 2021, 16:37:37
Birna, do you use your sachtler with any kind of middle or ground spreader or there is free movement for each leg?
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Birna Rørslett on June 30, 2021, 16:56:41
Free as the bird :)

I do have  spreader on the bigger Sacthlers used in my studio, though. Mainly because I don't care for the combination of tripod leg spikes and a wooden floor :)
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: golunvolo on June 30, 2021, 19:58:42
Makes sense  :)
 Thanks Birna
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Birna Rørslett on June 30, 2021, 21:39:08
I also sometimes use a smaller, cut-down Sachtler that only weighs 0.6 kg. It is packed when space (and weight) considerations are important. It has the same "carrying capacity" as the usual travel tripod. On occasion I put it under water as well.
Title: Re: LIGHT Tripod System for an Old Guy
Post by: Wannabebetter on September 11, 2021, 11:49:09
Somewhat off-topic, years ago I realized that any number of broken, used, or otherwise discarded metal legs -- even some rather flimsy off-brand models -- can be cut-down and repurposed for any number of uses, such as tabletop and ground-level macro/micro shoots. Even microphone stands, video conferencing, or desk lamps. Go crazy! 8)

Once the extendable sections are permanently removed from the legs, you can hacksaw as much off what remains of the tripod and/or extendable center column to suit your needs. Those (I forget what they're called) rubber feet you can purchase for canes and crutches can then be placed over the ends for gripping. Or just sand the newly sharpened ends and wrap several layers of waterproof tape around them. (Birna will thank you for it, too!) Alternately, you can devise something from champagne corks and iron nails or wood screws, if you prefer "spiked feet". (Don't even think of bringing that contraption into Birna's home. What am I saying?! Don't come near me, with that weapon! :o) You may be wondering, why not just use the original grips or spiked feet? If they're not already missing -- remember, we're repurposing junk -- they will likely be too small to fit what were the upper legs. In which case sawing-off just enough of the lower sections, with the feet or spikes still in place, to have something to wrap tape around, and shove into the remaining upper legs for a friction grip, should remedy the situation. Or just use epoxy.

Finish the project with a nice, fresh coat of black matte or crinkle paint for that "pro look"  ::) and be the envy of your peers. (Be prepared for a lot of can you make me one, entreaties.)

I believe that with the legs foreshorten thus, any wobbliness and vibration would be significantly reduced and even an inferior head would support reasonable weights in excess of its design parameters.