NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Camera Talk => Topic started by: Petr sheepeck Jůza on February 08, 2021, 00:58:45
-
Hi guys.
Please, would somebody let me know?
I got Nikon F2 and wonder if there is a possibilty to equip it with magnifying eyepiece? I use one (x1.35) on my D700 and it does help me a lot with focusing.
Thank you for any pointers.
Petr
-
Thinking out loud: can an adapter ring mate the DK-17M to the F2? Since the DK-17M has a larger thread diameter such an adapter may move the DK-17M too far from the prism for optical purpose. The more I think about this I don't think matting a DK-17M to an F2 is a likely proposition.
Nikon makes adapter rings to mate the smaller eyepiece accessories to the F3HP DE-3 and later threads. I'm unaware of any made by Nikon for the reverse.
Depending on the application Nikon made a DG-2 focusing magnifier. Some refer to the DG-2 as the poor man's 6x magnifier. This would not be for any kind of action or hand holding.
Then there is the DW-2, 6x waist level finder (second link). It's image is reversed right to left like a TLR but the camera can be hand held while using it. The 90 degree, 6x finder (first link, mid page) is most interesting to me. I wonder if it was ever mass produced or if it was only a prototypes? The 6x finders offers a beautiful, bright 5x7 inch like visual image.
Nikon Interchangeable Prisms for F2 Series bodies - Index Page (https://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf2/prisms/index.htm)
Nikon Interchangeable Prisms for F2 Series bodies - Part II (https://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf2/prisms/indexa.htm)
There is a part III, IV, V, etc. Look for "NEXT" near the bottom of each page.
Something I wondered about but didn't get any farther than thought was adapting a Pentax LX 45 degree angle finder to a Nikon F2 or F3. The Pentax finder might have been a 5x finder?
Dave
-
Thank you for the reply.
I completely forgot about these - DW-1 and DW-2.
Now I even remember why I forgot them - I probably stopped consider them because they switch the image (respectively do not switch it so it stays left/right conversed as with WLVF). :-)
Maybe one possible way to improve my focusing is to change the focusing screen - I have the B type - maybe K could be better with its split image. I could try this out with my friends camera. I will post here any findings I might have.
Petr
-
The DK-17m is a rare beast these days. To my knowledge the only two places to buy them new are a Korean (or Taiwan?) eBay seller, and an aliexpress seller. Big bucks either way!
-
I had DK-17m before but then switched for SMDV eyepiece as it has higher magnification - 1.35x
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SMDV-1-35x-Magnifying-Eyepiece-Eyecup-E-01-Universal-type-f-Canon-Nikon-Sony-etc-/162724075265
-
Gosh, thanks. That looks very useful.
-
Searching for "SMDV 1.35x Magnifying Eyepiece" I found this photo. I don't know what it fits but it looks smaller than the Nikon F3HP and later eyepiece fitting size.
I searched but was unsuccessful at finding a 1.35x eye piece for a Nikon F, F2 and F3 (DE-2). I wonder if the photo below is of such an eyepiece.
-
I tried to install a DG-2 on a F2 and it works quite well (after adjustment of focus on DG-2). It can be "flipped up" (hinged). It clicks into place......
The older version also works (it has no name other than Nikon). Is a bit strange. Normally everything Nikon makes.....even the smalles items....has a name.....
I thinks those magnifiers are cheap on the used market.
-
How is DG-2 usable for portraits? I have read that it allows you to see only central part of the image.
-
I think that is correct that the whole frame is not visible.
So you need to frame first with magnifier "flipped away" and then find the focus point for the framing. Then use magnifier to make exact focus at the point you know will give correct framing.
I will be a bit complicated.....
I think it correspond to zoom in...in viewfinder on a Z-camera with a MF lens to get exact focus.
-
Thank you.
As a first try I will experiment with different focusing screen and will see how mch it will change my seeing. Now I have type B installed, will switch for G.
-
How is DG-2 usable for portraits? I have read that it allows you to see only central part of the image.
This is correct.
-
I think that is correct that the whole frame is not visible.
So you need to frame first with magnifier "flipped away" and then find the focus point for the framing. Then use magnifier to make exact focus at the point you know will give correct framing.
I will be a bit complicated.....
I think it correspond to zoom in...in viewfinder on a Z-camera with a MF lens to get exact focus.
Unless camera is on a tripod and the portrait subject is sitting in a chair with the back well braced focus on the eye will easily be lost. A Nikon DG-2 will be useless for portraits.
With a Nikon D2H, DK-17M and 50/1.2 AIS at f/1.2 and 2m I found I was successful about 3 out of 4 tries at obtaining very good to critical focus when I sat in a chair. Standing I miss focus almost always as body sway exceeded the extremely narrow DoF. The D2H with a DK-17M gave an image magnification of 1.0x with a 50mm lens focus to infinity. The F3 (DE-2) and F2 (DE-1 and I think all others prisms) offer 0.80x. The F3HP (DE-3?) and F5 offer 0.75x.
Dave
-
Thank you.
As a first try I will experiment with different focusing screen and will see how mch it will change my seeing. Now I have type B installed, will switch for G.
For focusing on the matte surface of the focus screen you might try a NON-RED-DOT B or E screen. The non-red-dot are the screens made for the Nikon F, F2 and F3 (DE-2 or non-HP) cameras and have a course focus grit. The Red-Dot screens are bright, smooth screens and are not suitable for fast lenses. As I recall they don't show focus beyond f/2.8~f/2.5.
I would try using a Type A, split image rangefinder although it's not the best for focusing on a person's nearest eye.
Dave
The best solution would be if a 1.2x to 1.35x finder eyepiece if available for the F ~ F3 prism eyepiece threads. I wonder if that is what is in the picture I posted above. I didn't think to see if I could find the page on which the picture was displayed. I found that picture with a DuckDuckGo search for "SMDV 1.35x eyepiece."
-
There are also 3. party screens like "Beattie"?
https://www.french-camera.com/en/beattie-focusing-screen-for-nikon-ff2-90-split-image-plain-xml-246_311-7104.html
They may have made many different types for F2.
I remember that their screens was very bright compared to most "original" brands.
But then the light meter has to be adjusted a bit......probably or a handheld meter should be used.
-
They do these:
https://www.intenscreen.com/products_35mm-format_nikon.htm
Probably "much" brighter than the originals.
On a Hasselblad it was like "night and day".
-
................ With a Nikon D2H, DK-17M and 50/1.2 AIS at f/1.2 and 2m I found I was successful about 3 out of 4 tries .................
I have the same experience with D700 and 50/1.2 and 55/1.2 - that's why I almost always opted for shooting portraits in burst mode as I was mostly shooting portraits outside in the streets.
-
Surprizing findings - why I had a problem with focusing.
There was -2 diopter correction eyepiece. :-D
Now I need just normal rubber eyecup. :-)
-
They do these:
https://www.intenscreen.com/products_35mm-format_nikon.htm
Probably "much" brighter than the originals.
On a Hasselblad it was like "night and day".
Years ago I was at a cousin's daughter's wedding. The official photographer showed signs of hostility so I would take a few photos and move off quickly. The official photographer complained for all to hear that she could not focus her camera! Her camera was a Hasselblad 500CM or 503CM with an NC-2 prism. The setting was a reception in a park and it was night. My camera was a Nikon F4s with a AF 60/2.8 Micro-Nikkor. I was using an Nikon SB-800 Speedlight. I could focus in near total darkness with the SB-800's AF assist. If I could see the subject paint the subject with the AF assist the F4s could focus.
A trick I've used to focus in total darkness is to use a Mini Mag flashlight with a tiny bare halogen bulb. I wanted to help but didn't dare offer. Once I cammed a Linhof Technika and 150mm Nikkor-W and Mini Mag Flashlight.
Later I replaced the focus screen in my 500CM and had a custom eyepiece with astigmatism correction made. What a difference! A photographer should always have the best equipment for such a shoot.
I got a few good shots. Here is one of the bride clowning...
(https://live.staticflickr.com/5337/16950110694_66e9f1cd23_h.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/rPPKnQ)Charlie and Lori Wedding: Carriage Clowning (https://flic.kr/p/rPPKnQ) by Dave Hartman (https://www.flickr.com/photos/mr_speedlight/)
Today's photographers have it so good when shooting modern AF cameras like the Nilon D6, D850, Z6 II, Z7 II and others!
-
Back on topic...
Has anyone found a 1.2x to 1.35x prism eyepiece that fits the Nikon F2 (all prism finders) and the Nikon F3 (DE-2 prism)?
Has anyone found a 1.2x to 1.35x prism eyepiece that fits a Nikon F3HP (DE-3) and later as the D850 that offers more eye relief than the discontinued DK-17M so one who wears glasses might shoot through their glasses and see the full frame?
Dave
-
Back on topic...
Has anyone found a 1.2x to 1.35x prism eyepiece that fits the Nikon F2 (all prism finders) and the Nikon F3 (DE-2 prism)?
Has anyone found a 1.2x to 1.35x prism eyepiece that fits a Nikon F3HP (DE-3) and later as the D850 that offers more eye relief than the discontinued DK-17M so one who wears glasses might shoot through their glasses and see the full frame?
Dave
I saw this mentioned here. I have one on order ...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SMDV-1-35x-Magnifying-Eyepiece-Eyecup-E-01-Universal-type-f-Canon-Nikon-Sony-etc/162724075265?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
The DK-17m can still be found on Alibaba, but at a price!!
It drives me crazy that such a simple and useful thing was discontinued. It's small things like this that makes me lose confidence in Nikon. The market knows how valuable this eyepiece is. You can track the selling price over history on ebay, and Japan Yahoo auctions and Mercari. It's bonkers how a tiny bit of glass can command ¥8,000+ Grrrrrrr.....
-
Surprizing findings - why I had a problem with focusing.
There was -2 diopter correction eyepiece. :-D
Now I need just normal rubber eyecup. :-)
I love hearing stories like that :-) Over 50% of my issues (photography and otherwise ) were down to human error.
I have even been known to fall over as a result of wearing reading glasses outside in the real world.
-
...
The DK-17m can still be found on Alibaba, but at a price!!
It drives me crazy that such a simple and useful thing was discontinued. It's small things like this that makes me lose confidence in Nikon. The market knows how valuable this eyepiece is. You can track the selling price over history on ebay, and Japan Yahoo auctions and Mercari. It's bonkers how a tiny bit of glass can command ¥8,000+ Grrrrrrr.....
The DK-17M is a tough piece of glass. I have described here before (https://nikongear.net/revival/index.php?topic=8057.msg130606#msg130606 (https://nikongear.net/revival/index.php?topic=8057.msg130606#msg130606)) how I lost mine on the tundra in northern Alaska during field work. The next year one of our Ph.D. students spotted it way off from the location I had been, only the rubber eyecup attached to it chewed on, likely by Arctic ground squirrels. (It was not just by chance that she was the one who found it, she has an eye for it and has found several other small lost items for us on the tundra.) I just washed the silt off it and found it was fully functional. It is still one of two DK17M I have in use - likely the one I adapted to D7100, but not quite sure, it could also be the one on my D500.
[Edit: link to old post added]
-
my main issue with the DK-17M is it doesn't work right for eyeglass wearers :o :o :o magnification is too-wide ::)
-
my main issue with the DK-17M is it doesn't work right for eyeglass wearers :o :o :o magnification is too-wide ::)
The problem may be in part facial structure. I've known people who had more problems using a Nikon FE2 with glasses than I had which was minimal. The FE2 had a eyepiece magnification of 0.86x with a 50mm lens focused to infinity. The FM3a (FE3) had a viewfinder magnification of 0.83x which gave it better eye point for many users without reducing focusing ease noticeably.
I'm probably repeating myself but I could use the DK-17M with my D2H, see the complete frame and data while wearing glasses. That gave me a 1.0x viewfinder magnification with 50mm lens focused at infinity. That made the D2H quite suitable for use with manual focus lenses although I had major issues with the D2H regarding dynamic range and color balance issues. I have not been able to use the DK-17M with my D800 and D850 with bifocal or reading glasses. Although I can see the complete frame and data without glasses then I am unable to use the rear LCD monitor. I could not use the similar Nikon DK-21M eyepiece magnifier with my D300s.
Clearly Nikon is aware of the eye point or eye relief issues of eye glass wearers or they would never have made the Nikon F3HP (DE-3). I wish Nikon would make a 1.2x eye piece magnifier using Fresnel elements that was designed specifically for eye glass users. I'm quite sure such and eyepiece magnifier is possible.
Dave
-
*** Does anyone use Granny Glasses (half readers) with a Nikon FX DSLR? ***
I've been thinking since this discussion about "granny glasses." I wonder if I could use my D850 together with the DK-17M if I could bring the camera close to my face with the DK-17M above the granny glasses then when I drop the camera to my chest I could view the rear monitor though the granny glasses. If this worked I could use the DK-17M with my D850.
I can't remember seeing granny glasses for sale in the stores I frequent. I think I'll start looking on line for them.
Dave
-
Do these count as granny glasses? If so, I used to wear them back in the day.
(A gold star for anyone who recognizes this photo :-) )
-
What I call granny glasses are half glasses with a diopter for reading in the lower half. The top half is omitted, not there. The wearer looks over the lower half to see clearly at distance. These glasses are for people who only need correction for close vision.
-
I love hearing stories like that :-) .........
Yes, quite amusing. :-)
Nevertheless - I might also exchange the focusing screen. I installed G2 version which I prefer over my previous E (not B as I thought) and then I was able to try also my friend's F2 with K screen. I think the K is great. Now we switched screens so I have the K for about week or two to test. :-)