NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Lens Talk => Topic started by: Akira on July 11, 2017, 07:00:24
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https://www.dpreview.com/news/1194383954/nikon-reveals-full-frame-af-p-nikkor-70-300mm-f4-5-5-6e-ed-vr
So far as the published MTF charts are compared, the lately improved version of Tamron zoom seems to perform better at the longest setting.
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According to the Nikon's website, this new zoom imposes some incompatibility issue similar to that of the AF-P zooms for DX:
With D3 and D4 series, D8x0 series, Df, D700, D300 series, D7x00 series and D5200, when the camera is turned off (either manually or automatically by the battery saving function) after the lens is focused, the focus will be off when the camera is turned on again.
D5, D750, D6x0 series, D5500, D5300 and D3300 needs the firmware to be of the latest version to use the lens.
The lens cannot be used with any models older than the above mentioned ones as well as the film bodies.
The price offered by Fujiya Camera in Tokyo which I use often is 91,800 JPY. The newer Tamron sibling is sold for 37,000 JPY at the same store now.
I would expect the blindingly fast AF as proved by its DX sibling on my D750.
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Loaded to my site. Looking at the specifications, the new lens is marginally bigger than the old version, but weighs less - 680g vs 745g.
Although it focuses 0.3m closer, the maximum magnification is the same at 1/4, which means there is more "focus breathing", or reduction of focal length at close range - probably to make the focusing elements as light-weight as possible.
It has a more complex optical design with 18 elements in 14 groups, but only one ED element.
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Nikon USA lists different compatibility information (http://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-products/product/camera-lenses/af-p-nikkor-70-300mm-f%252f4.5-5.6e-ed-vr.html):
"Fully compatible models: D7500, D5600, D5500, D5300*, D3400, D3300*, D500 and later models"
"Compatible models with limited functions: D5, D810 series, Df, D750, D7200, D7100, D5200, Nikon 1 series with the FT1"
"Incompatible models: D4 series, D3 series, D2 series, D1 series, D800 series, D700, D610, D600, D300 series, D200, D100, D7000, D5100, D5000, D90, D80, D70 series, D3200, D3100, D3000, D60, D50, D40 series, film cameras"
I wonder what is going on.
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It will be interesting to see if there will be firmware releases for the partially compatible camera models and maybe some of the incompatible models in the months ahead. Many of these cameras are still current models (D5, Df, D810, D750 etc etc).
IIRC, firmware support for the AF-S NIKKOR 800mm f/5.6E FL ED VR on the Nikon D700 was added several years after Nikon stopped making that particular camera. Let us hope that they do the same for these new lenses.
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It will be interesting to see if there will be firmware releases for the partially compatible camera models and maybe some of the incompatible models in the months ahead. Many of these cameras are still current models (D5, Df, D810, D750 etc etc).
I hope so also; if Nikon can achieve good compatibility with AF-P lenses using FX bodies introduced from 2007 onwards (those are the ones that support E lenses) and corresponding E-compatible DX cameras then the situation is manageable.
The Nikon Japan list of incompatibilities appears less severe than the one published by Nikon USA. I suspect the Japanese site is probably more accurate. Nikon USA have had errors in their compatibility tables before.
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There is no mention whatsoever of this lens on the Nikon UK website.
So - obviously - it doesn't exist. After all, Nikon UK are never, ever wrong about anything. :( >:(
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There is no mention whatsoever of this lens on the Nikon UK website.
http://www.europe-nikon.com/en_GB/product/nikkor-lenses/auto-focus-lenses/fx/zoom/af-p-nikkor-70-300mm-f-4-5-5-6e-ed-vr
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Interestingly enough now the Nikon USA page says this
"The number of cameras compatible with this lens is limited. Even for compatible cameras, a firmware update may be required. Fully compatible models: D7500, D5600, D3400, D500.
Fully compatible models (without limitations) after available firmware update: D5, D750, D610, D600, D5500, D5300, D3300. Download firmware updates at: http://downloadcenter.nikonimglib.com/en/index.html
Regardless of firmware update, these models will still have some limitations:* D4, D4S, D3, D3X, D3S, D810, D810A, D800, D800E, Df, D700, D300, D300S, D7200, D7100, D7000, D5200.
*Because these models reset focus when reverting from standby status (timer off), pre-focus shooting is not available.
Incompatible models: D2 series, D1 series, D200, D100, D90, D80, D70 series, D60, D50, D40 series, D5100, D5000, D3200, D3100, D3000, film SLR cameras."
Which is different from what was there this morning.
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Regardless of firmware update, these models will still have some limitations:* D4, D4S, D3, D3X, D3S, D810, D810A, D800, D800E, Df, D700, D300, D300S, D7200, D7100, D7000, D5200.
*Because these models reset focus when reverting from standby status (timer off), pre-focus shooting is not available.
Sounds like a lens I really don't want…
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Regardless of firmware update, these models will still have some limitations:* D4, D4S, D3, D3X, D3S, D810, D810A, D800, D800E, Df, D700, D300, D300S, D7200, D7100, D7000, D5200.
*Because these models reset focus when reverting from standby status (timer off), pre-focus shooting is not available.
It sounds like AF-ON focus with the AF disassociated from the shutter release button will allow prefocus since the camera will not attempt focus until the AF-ON button is pressed.
...or did I miss understand the issue?
To me the issue sounds like a hiccup.
Dave Hartman
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The Nikon Japan list of incompatibilities appears less severe than the one published by Nikon USA. I suspect the Japanese site is probably more accurate. Nikon USA have had errors in their compatibility tables before.
I don't think Nikon USA understands the Proofreader Principle.
Before the website change the wording regarding the Nikon PK-11a indicated it was compatible with all AF lenses. In fact there is interference or jamming of contacts of AF lenses other than the AF and AF-D type lenses the PK-11a was designed to work with.
I don't think Nikon Global puts enough effort into translation and this over the decades. I seen many sometimes glaring errors in technical information if leaflets and instruction manuals over the decades.
Dave
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To me the issue sounds like a hiccup.
I think the stepper motor may need current to remain at a fixed setting of focus distance. Maybe the older cameras are not equipped to provide that current in a continuous manner during standby?
It seems highly unfortunate that they didn't see this coming.
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Changing focus after power off/on cycle is the same behavior I see on the nikon 1 V1 native lenses, and well, I do not like it
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To remain at a fixed settings of distance for standby, new camera needs still current. But when one turned the body to working position by pressing release button, or simply ON, dedicated camera, keeping distance info in advancing chip, is restoring it. Older cameras has no so advanced chips. Some of them could be update, partially or at full, some absolutely not. I think so, till Nikon explanations are out, maybe. LZ
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Folks, there would be no wonder if Nikon itself is confused with the (in)compatibility issue. When I wanted to try the new DX 70-300 zoom released previously with my D750 at the Nikon showroom in Shinjuku, the attendant said, "no, it cannot be used with D750." I did know it was doable because I had checked out the compatibility and the known issue on Nikon's own website.
The confusion should be sorted out in the meantime. :)
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The confusion should be sorted out in the meantime. :)
That's a job for Agent 99!
Dave
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I think the stepper motor may need current to remain at a fixed setting of focus distance. Maybe the older cameras are not equipped to provide that current in a continuous manner during standby?
It seems highly unfortunate that they didn't see this coming.
Several hiccups in a row?
If that is the case then releasing the AF-ON button would not lock the AF. If what you suggest, which sounds likely, then the work-a-round would be a 30 or 60 seconds meter off delay. I think I'm using 10 seconds now.
The problem would be primarily battery drain as the AF-P stepper and VR as well as the meter would all be sucking juice.
Dave
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I had a question about AF-On with the new p lenses, and got at least a partial answer today. Went to a store, and the clerk there handed me a D500 with the AFP-Dx 70-300 which I assume resembles the others. I did not have time to test it with back button focus (the clerk was a little busy, and I did not have time to stick it on my own D7100 either). But what I did find was that if you start it up with the AF turned off at the camera, all focus is dead. If you start it up in AF and focus it, then turn off the AF on the camera, the AF setting remains, and manual override also remains on. I don't quite understand how that all works, but there it is. It would appear, then, that if AF-ON is similar to turning the AF switch off, the lens will retain manual override if the AF has been engaged first.
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One interesting perspective of possible implications of this new AFP lens
https://photographylife.com/nikon-full-frame-mirrorless-is-on-its-way#more-146763
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IMO AF-P isn't about mirrorless but autofocus during the recording of video. Mirrorless will have its own lenses.
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Are we reading too much into why Nikon has constructed this lens in the way it has?
Perhaps building a lens with stepper motor focus is the simplest and most economical way to build a lens now days, especially for robotic assembly?
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IMO AF-P isn't about mirrorless but autofocus during the recording of video. Mirrorless will have its own lenses.
Would I be wrong in assuming some designs will cross over?
Dave