NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Lens Talk => Topic started by: armando_m on February 20, 2017, 16:11:51
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Just got this today, FB for once proved a useful resource, as I found the lens at a very reasonable price, the location was where a friend lives and who conveniently was coming my way this weekend
I may want to lubricate the focus, resistance is even but perhaps a bit stiff
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Congrats Armando:
Look forward to images created with it!
Randy
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For the time being I can mount it on the V1 + FT adapter
I will need a bit of courage to do the AI modification so I can mount it on the D800
... and lets see how frustrated I get with the Manual focus
Coffee mug at the office
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Armando, congrats. Is that at f1.2? I've had a couple of 50 f1.2 Ais offered to me at good prices but I just do not feel I would use one. You are much better and I look forward to seeing your using the lens.
All the best,
Tom
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Congratulations! Very nice :)
What is sticking into the lens in the front shot?
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Thanks Tom and Eric, yes the coffee mug is at f1.2, with the V1 crop ...
On the front shot, seen through the lens, is the aperture lever, and the desk
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Congratulations. I have the AI version and it was my favorite lens on my d200. While it is a dreamy mess wide open, it is quite sharp at f/4. I like lenses which have the ability to give very different looks.
I have not used it on my Df because I'm in love with 18mm, but I should give it a try.
Here is an old shot wide open
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4026/4580028339_f98c1da1b8_o_d.jpg)
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Didn't realice you could see the aperture leaver though the lens like that, Thanks!
Enjoy!
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Thanks Jack
Here is quick portrait, found a volunteer (who complained that she is not photogenic), lit by a white projection on the wall to get better light vs the ceiling fluorescent lights
V1 iso 800 f1.2 1/125
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Much nicer than a coffee mug. On less than FX it is great for soft portraits I think.
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Congratulations Armando. Every f/1.2 lens is great ! The 55mm for sure ;) Lots of creative possibilities on every camera.
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Very nice windowlight! Even mores so the smile :) Perfect
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Much nicer than a coffee mug.
;D
I thik so too.
Congratulations on your new lens!
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congrats Armando. There is no doubt you will have lots of subject matter that this lens will be put to good use in your hands.
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Looks promising, Armando!
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Thanks for the comments
Can't wait to try on the D800
I will not have time to attempt to modify the lens until wednesday
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I have an AI modified one for sale if anyone is interested. It is the New Nikkor (K) version which focuses closer than the older types (0.5m vs 0.6m). The lens is in good shape, optically and mechanically fine. Asking $275 USD
Pictures here: http://www.photosynthesis.co.nz/nikon/trade/5512.html
I probably should list it in the classified ads...
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http://richardhaw.com/2016/02/06/repair-new-nikkor-55mm-f1-2/
these are great lenses :o :o :o
i love mine
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Lens rework, it now fits the D800
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Looks great. Show some photos with it!
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Nice job, Armando! I'm overwhelmed by the amount of the bearing balls... :o :o :o
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Very nice job ;)
This vintage of lenses all had a he amount of steel-balls in the aperture mechanism before they thought of the holding-ring, a pain to put back together after chipping,,, that's why I sometimes opt for just leaving them in while machining,,, ::)
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A couple of shots at f1.2...
1. Caps at about minimum focusing distance
2. Kid at about 2.5m , the focus on the nose, rather than the eye , probably because we moved, I focused with liveview and also likely has motion blur as it is a 1/15 exposure
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Thanks for the comments
I was surprised that every screw was a flat head, don't know the right term, the opposite to the philips or JIS
I do not own nice and small enough flat screwdrivers, but tried with my jewelers set and it worked
All the screws were rather loose, I guess the lens was serviced in the past
The aperture ring had some sand underneath, now clean and with new grease it moves smoothly and clicks are precise
I did not venture into the focus helicoid, which I wanted to do , but the screws are tiny and my screwdrivers are not good enough, time to pay a visit to the tools shop where I got my JIS set.
The aperture spring got undone, and I was worried the ball bearings may get undone, which gladly did not happen
I did read Richard's blog about the 55mm repair, and AI conversion, since I do not own a support for the dremel that moves, his suggestion to control the depth of the cut of the dremel using a magazine was quite useful
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Nikon used slot-head screws before switching the cross-head JIS in the early 1970s (roughly coinciding with the introduction of the multicoated "C" lenses). Your lens is from the first series made between late 1965 - late 1967.
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A last test image before moving to other threads
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super expression and a good focus on the eye(s), means you put in speed grease ?
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super expression and a good focus on the eye(s), means you put in speed grease ?
speed grease ?
1/500
Also the camera is on a tripod and I focused in live view, it helps that I'm holding her favorite toy while I focus , after shooting I'll throw the toy and she will come back ready to do another intense pose and repeat all day long
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speed grease is a joke...for superfast focussing actions
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speed grease is a joke...for superfast focussing actions
LOL... well you can see it was exactly the opposite, super slow and cumbersome focusing
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Congratulations!
Rick just serviced my copy of this lens a while ago and did an outstanding job. Still my copy seems to be a bit rough, but I really like what the lens gives me. Made some of my favorite photos with the lens on DX as well as FX cameras
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2009/33029690455_77ebbb08ce_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SjHNeD)T4288x2844-00076 (https://flic.kr/p/SjHNeD) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2751/32647643560_d8c748d91e_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RJXH1d)T4288x2844-00229 (https://flic.kr/p/RJXH1d) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/370/31604878974_14f07350a5_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Q9Pgqs)DSC_5744-Edit (https://flic.kr/p/Q9Pgqs) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
The shot below is at f2 where the lens really sharpens up
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5452/30505529905_5ff2fce877_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/NtEPfa)DSC_3978 (https://flic.kr/p/NtEPfa) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
Wide open again
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7100/26552142034_b0a010486c_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/GsjELj)Take a seat (https://flic.kr/p/GsjELj) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
At f5,6
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/728/22651189655_8d5eb458d2_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/AvBgwF)DSC_0650 (https://flic.kr/p/AvBgwF) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
And wide open again
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7735/17640471874_f331783e10_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/sSQ2GN)_DSC3656-2 (https://flic.kr/p/sSQ2GN) by b j (https://www.flickr.com/photos/132836932@N03/), on Flickr
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Gorgeous images!
on the dog jumping the log, did you prefocus on the log, or followed the dog moving towards you ? anyway fantastic results
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Buddy. I anm overwhelmed by the collection of images. You are are true genious, but you know that anyway...
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Frank, I'm a happy snapper. When it comes to manipulating light and perspective, Kristina is the true genius. I just try to empulate what I learn by watching her in her art and emulate what I learn into my own style.
Armando, prefocusing on the log would not give very good results. It's a mix of both. I studied Amy, and how she jumps over obstacles for a while now. I know where during the jump she looks the way I want her to, so I take the log as a reference point, prefocus slightly in front of the log (about 30cm) because i know she will hover in about this position right there, then wait for her to be at that position. I start shooting about 3 frames before she traverses this point, and from the 4th frame onwards try to adjust focus to track the movement. This usually gives me 2-3 keepers in a series of 6 or 7 images.
When I'm lazy I just prefocus on a spot in front of the log and make Amy repeat the jump a few times ;)
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These images really show the rendering characteristics of the lens very well! The out of focus highlights are used very creatively. Thanks for sharing :)
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For the time being I can mount it on the V1 + FT adapter
UPDATE: I REMEMBERED WRONG when posting this: "Based on my experience with the 58 mm f/1,2 Noct it can be mounted on FT/V1, but not used at f/1,2 due to the internal characteristics of the FT adapter"
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Based on my experience with the 58 mm f/1,2 Noct it can be mounted on FT/V1, but not used at f/1,2 due to the internal characteristics of the FT adapter
This is not correct. I'm using the Nocts, the 55/1.2 K and CRT 55/1.2 on the V1 or AW1 all the time. Even the 85/1 Repro works just fine. All of them functions perfectly at their widest aperture. (they are CPU-modified except for the 55/1.2 K).
The "speed" of the lens does not change when it is mounted to the CX format via the FT-1. The light meter responds properly and exposures come out perfect.
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Nikon warns that there may be cases where the background bokeh of f1.4 and faster lenses wide open may be cut out under circumstances, which suggest that the peripheral portion of the image forming incident light may also be cut especially when the lens is focused at distant subject (and the rear element is close to the opening of FT1 mount adapter).
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True, but that does not influence the exposure as such. One can get strange cuts into the confusion circles, like with any other mask inserted into the light path. Just think of the "cat's eye" vignetting so typical of mechanical obstructions of the lens barrel in fast lenses. However, a mask following after the exit pupil will not change the intensity of the illumination in the film/sensor plane.
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This is not correct. I'm using the Nocts, the 55/1.2 K and CRT 55/1.2 on the V1 or AW1 all the time. Even the 85/1 Repro works just fine. All of them functions perfectly at their widest aperture. (they are CPU-modified except for the 55/1.2 K).
The "speed" of the lens does not change when it is mounted to the CX format via the FT-1. The light meter responds properly and exposures come out perfect.
I remembered wrong, as you stated it is actually usable . Can't reconstruct how I got this in my mind, cause it was years ago
Actually I might have experienced these confusion circle cuts which limit the use of that kind of lens a little bit
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I shot a few images using an aperture smaller than 1.2 and experienced what I think is an sluggish aperture control, as a number of images were overexposed
I got around this pressing the DOF button in the camera before pressing the shutter button
I need to gather some courage, and get better screwdrivers :) before attempting to go all the way to cleaning the aperture blades
An example of what happened, both images with the same exposure and lights
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An example of what happened, both images with the same exposure and lights
But a completely different scene so perhaps not a good way to evaluate the problem?
Also a failing flash could vary its exposure as well, though the DOF button trick seems to lean towards a camera/lens error.
Why not try to recreate this under a more controlled setting? Camera on a tripod, constant light source, take lots of pictures and watch for varying exposure.
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Very nice pictures of the Solitaire. But I am somewhat disappointed about the bokeh which looks very unresty to me.
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I shot a few images using an aperture smaller than 1.2 and experienced what I think is an sluggish aperture control, as a number of images were overexposed
I got around this pressing the DOF button in the camera before pressing the shutter button
Since the stop down activation is the assumed to be the same mechanism used by both the DOF preview button and the camera shutter firing cycle, you should be able to reproduce and observe the problem by watching the lens front and firing the shutter...or pushing the DOF preview button... numerous times. I had a AiS 135/2 that had an intermittent aperture closing issue, but the technician who fixed it didn't say what he did to fix it. Is it possible that the coil spring gets tired and weakened?
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Lubricants leaking onto the aperture blades will cause the noted behaviour. Some lens designs are particularly prone to getting this problem, with the 55/2.8 Micro as the most infamous example. Also the AF 20/2.8 saw a good deal of these issues.
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Very nice pictures of the Solitaire. But I am somewhat disappointed about the bokeh which looks very unresty to me.
The 55/1.2 does not render backgrounds with the smoothness of the 58/1.2 Noct, it is very "textured". It can be used to good effect but care must be taken when choosing the background. The foreground bokeh on the other hand is very smooth...
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bubbles :o :o :o
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Lubricants leaking onto the aperture blades will cause the noted behaviour. Some lens designs are particularly prone to getting this problem, with the 55/2.8 Micro as the most infamous example. Also the AF 20/2.8 saw a good deal of these issues.
Thanks for commenting, I'll certainly report how things go after cleaning the aperture blades
Since the stop down activation is the assumed to be the same mechanism used by both the DOF preview button and the camera shutter firing cycle, you should be able to reproduce and observe the problem by watching the lens front and firing the shutter...or pushing the DOF preview button... numerous times. I had a AiS 135/2 that had an intermittent aperture closing issue, but the technician who fixed it didn't say what he did to fix it. Is it possible that the coil spring gets tired and weakened?
Thanks for the suggestion, setting the lens to F16 should make it easy to observe
But a completely different scene so perhaps not a good way to evaluate the problem?
Also a failing flash could vary its exposure as well, though the DOF button trick seems to lean towards a camera/lens error.
Why not try to recreate this under a more controlled setting? Camera on a tripod, constant light source, take lots of pictures and watch for varying exposure.
Charlie,
I did try the sunny 16 rule, (1/125 f/16 ISO 100)and the behavior became much more easier to obtain, like 1 every 2 shots, the example studio shots were done at f5.6 and the problem happened twice in a series of perhaps 20 shots.
In my experience when a flash fails, one gets an underexposed image, not over exposed.
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Great lens Armando. I hope you get all the small annoyances fixed soon.
One question about the first picture. I see there is a landline telephone. Is it still in use?
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http://richardhaw.com/2017/03/15/repair-nikkor-s-c-55mm-f1-2/
The Nikkor-S.C 55/1.2 teardown :o :o :o
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Great lens Armando. I hope you get all the small annoyances fixed soon.
One question about the first picture. I see there is a landline telephone. Is it still in use?
yes , it is actually a digital phone connected yo the network
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http://richardhaw.com/2017/03/15/repair-nikkor-s-c-55mm-f1-2/
The Nikkor-S.C 55/1.2 teardown :o :o :o
Thank You Richard
This is very helpful
ok, today activity: Disassembled the lens ... and cleaned it , the offending grease was outside the optical assembly, also took the time to clean the focus helicoids.
Tested with a few F16 shots and it seems to work correctly
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an image at 1.2
While I was doing this I checked the 50 f1.8 E series, and it also has a laggy aperture mechanism , more than what it was on the 55 f1.2
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Armando:
I like the colors and feel of this image. Dreamy.
Randy
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Very delicate. I like the rendering as well
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Just to be sure; Have a look (compare with other camera) at the stop down aperture leaver of the camera, these can also be bent out of shape by inserting a lens slightly askew, I have seen several Df cameras with this damage,,,
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lovely image, Armando!
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Delicate image, Armando.
Just to be sure; Have a look (compare with other camera) at the stop down aperture leaver of the camera, these can also be bent out of shape by inserting a lens slightly askew, I have seen several Df cameras with this damage,,,
Ah, it´s OT here, but I noticed the same with my Df. With some lenses stopping down gives over-exposure. The lever seems to be bent a little, and moving it usually solves the problem. Is that a job for the Nikon Service center?
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Just to be sure; Have a look (compare with other camera) at the stop down aperture leaver of the camera, these can also be bent out of shape by inserting a lens slightly askew, I have seen several Df cameras with this damage,,,
Erik, I'll check it out, thanks for the hint
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It's easy enough to check the lens by activating the Aperture Stop-down Lever on the lens bayonet with your finger. If the aperture is free and active then it's something other than the lens. The most obvious as noted above is the Aperture Coupling Lever in the body.
Dave Hartman
[I suppose if the aperture stop-down lever in the lens is bent that might cause binding but with two lenses sluggish it sounds like the body. I've never seen this myself: touch silicon. This all assumes the aperture blades aren't lube contaminated which unfortunately I have seen.]
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It's easy enough to check the lens by activating the Aperture Stop-down Lever on the lens bayonet with your finger. If the aperture is free and active then it's something other than the lens. The most obvious as noted above is the Aperture Coupling Lever in the body.
Dave Hartman
[I suppose if the aperture stop-down lever in the lens is bent that might cause binding but with two lenses sluggish it sounds like the body. I've never seen this myself: touch silicon. This all assumes the aperture blades aren't lube contaminated which unfortunately I have seen.]
Just because the actuation lever on the lens moves freely, doesn't mean that the aperture is free from 'failure to stop down' syndrome.
On my problem 135/2 AiS, the iris would intermittently fail to stop down...like 1 out of 20 times...but the actuation lever on the lens moved freely and smoothly at all times.
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Hi Armando
Today I bought my first Nikon lens ever (55 1.2 SC), probably the second best buy i've done on a lens. Price US 235 $.
Leaving Norway for Portugal next week, bringing one camera and 2 lenses.
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Does anyone have a recommendation about what kind of grease should I use to lubricate the focus helicoids ?
the 55mm is significantly more stiff than the other manual lenses I have 35, 105, and 200 mm
I recently cleaned it and re-grease it , to find out I made even more stiff with the grease I used
a white/translucent silicon grease
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Hi Armando
Today I bought my first Nikon lens ever (55 1.2 SC), probably the second best buy i've done on a lens. Price US 235 $.
Leaving Norway for Portugal next week, bringing one camera and 2 lenses.
Bjørn , your copy is SC vs mine that is only S , I assume the difference being that the SC has more modern coatings on the glass
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Micro-tools Grease, Helical #10 (Light) 8ml
The have a EU and an US online shop
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Micro-tools Grease, Helical #10 (Light) 8ml
The have a EU and an US online shop
Great, thanks Erik
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Micro-tools Grease, Helical #10 (Light) 8ml
The have a EU and an US online shop
Would this also work for other Nikkors? I have a Nikkor K 28mm 3.5 that may need additional lubrication.
Thanks!
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Bjørn , your copy is SC vs mine that is only S , I assume the difference being that the SC has more modern coatings on the glass
Nikon refined the optics twice. The original optics are found in the early Nikkor-S series with serial numbers 970111 - 985xxx. At some point the optics were changed, the curvature and spacing of some elements is different. To the best of my knowledge this occurred when the serial number was reset to 184711. This is still a Nikkor-S, continuing through the Nikkor-S.C up to serial no 300556. The optics were refined yet again for the New-Nikkor (K) and AI versions, probably to improve close range performance since this model focuses closer than the previous versions (0.5m vs 0.6m).
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Would this also work for other Nikkors? I have a Nikkor K 28mm 3.5 that may need additional lubrication.
Thanks!
Sure it's universal, there is a 'heavy' version also but it is often too thick ;)
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Nikon refined the optics twice. The original optics are found in the early Nikkor-S series with serial numbers 970111 - 985xxx. At some point the optics were changed, the curvature and spacing of some elements is different. To the best of my knowledge this occurred when the serial number was reset to 184711. This is still a Nikkor-S, continuing through the Nikkor-S.C up to serial no 300556. The optics were refined yet again for the New-Nikkor (K) and AI versions, probably to improve close range performance since this model focuses closer than the previous versions (0.5m vs 0.6m).
thanks for your insights :o :o :o
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I have this in "K" version. In a past I had a 50 1.2 and sometimes wonder which is better.
1., 2. and 3. are 55 mm, 4., 5. and 6. are 50 mm. Still cannot say which I like more. :-)
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Very nice images! They showcase these lenses very well!
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Great portraiture, Sheepeck!
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You've made great use of the properties of the 55/1.2.
My copy of the 55/1.2 K/Ai was an sharp, high-definition, contrasty lens once the wide-open dreamy-haze effect was squelched by about f/2.8.
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Great portraiture, Sheepeck!
Yes, beauties.
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Thank you guys.
I usually try to shoot these fast lenses fully open even though their sharpness could be improved if closed down a bit. :-)
Looking forward the time when our anticorona rules are lifted and people outside will again walk freely so I can carry camera around and ask some interesting strangers for few frames. :-)
Until then I will search websites and dream about some new lenses. Duh... :-D Nikkor 135 2 being my possible next target.
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Beautiful photographs, I find the last one specially sensual.
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During weekend I got out with this lens again and tried some "product photo" :-)
And already started searching web for 50 1.2 and cannot decide if ai or ai-s.
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And already started searching web for 50 1.2 and cannot decide if ai or ai-s.
They are virtually identical.
Same optical formula. Same coatings. Same results (I made some extensive tests), except for the OOF dot shapes when stopped down: 7 vs. 9 straight blades, but in this particular case it does not really matter.
Externally, the AI outer diameter is larger by 2mm and it looks more like a Noct, while the AIS is a bit more "cylindrical".
Rendering, at medium apertures, is quite vivid - that elusive "3D pop" effect seems to apply, but is probably subjective. This is why I often use it for sreet shots (esp. demos or festivals), first because the FL is adequate, second because I get lively scenes despite unpredictable and/or messy surroundings. Clean images at f/2 also help. f/1.2-f/1.4 are more for the fun; here the Noct is definitely superior, but I do not want to put it at a risk!
I guess there is more variability across copies than across lens types (AI/AIS) here, so look for the best deal.
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Thank you for input.
I think you are right - deal and condition of the lens will be the key for decision. :-)
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One more difference: the AI has a longer focus throw, 180° from infinity to 0.5m. The AI-S gets there with just 110° turn of the focus ring. If you need to focus quickly, the AI-S may be preferred. If you shoot at wider apertures with very shallow DoF, the slower more precise focusing of the AI may be useful.
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Oh, yes - that I also considered. I'm not into street photo or anywhere where the speed is needed. I shoot maily portraits and things which doesn't move as the photo above illustrate. So I could be OK with any of those options probably.
Oh - one more difference between those lenses I found.
Colour of the aperture numbering. :-)
f16 number is either in blue or orange colour. Important thing to ponder. :-D
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Build quality, internals the Ai is more solidly build compared to the Ais version, 30 grams more material on the focus system, threads and guides!
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Note taken. Thank you.
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Bokeh is better on the AIS version, due to 9 blades. As well as color, not much, but visible. LZ
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The blue f16 on the AI version seals the deal for me :)
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The blue f16 on the AI version seals the deal for me :)
;D Hehe
These colors of the Ai aperture values on the aperture ring and corresponding markings on the lens barrel have revived for some fancy tools, brands like Wera which make some amazing screwdriver bits and accessories, use a similar color coding for the size of tools, very useful if you are good at remembering colors and values, especially for us who are now entered the reading glasses age ;)
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Sounds OK to me - colour coding of the values of electronic componentry has been around for many decades. So why not f-stops? ;D
;D Hehe
These colors of the Ai aperture values on the aperture ring and corresponding markings on the lens barrel have revived for some fancy tools, brands like Wera which make some amazing screwdriver bits and accessories, use a similar color coding for the size of tools, very useful if you are good at remembering colors and values, especially for us who are now entered the reading glasses age ;)
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Yes also in the electronics industry ;) They even also have the Gold ring versions ;D
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Quite so. And silver. ;D
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The blue f16 on the AI version seals the deal for me :)
:D I'm inclined for orange. :D
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But finally decided otherway and went for blue. :-)
Ordered in Japan.
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Congratulations! Be patient, international post is a lot slower these days due to covid. I recently had some old lens accessories sent from Japan to New Zealand, normally it would take 2 weeks at the most, it finally arrived after more than 5 weeks. The important thing is that it did arrive! :)
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But finally decided otherway and went for blue. :-)
Ordered in Japan.
Good choice. The AI indeed has become my favorite, 7-blades notwithstanding.
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Just to close this episode - Nikkor 50 1.2 ai which I bought just arrived and stands in front of me on the table.
I never before got a lens in such pristine condition!! It looks like brand new! I even don´t see any dust paticle inside.
I´m really surpriced and happy with that purchase.
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Congratulation! Do share images and thoughts ;)
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Here I am with the first findings.
I dare to post the shots here even though I know that this thread is named “new 55” but since I posted some shots comparing 55 with 50 ai-s (on the 5th page) I think that I could round it up with some shots taken with 50 ai.
Due to cold weather combined with corona virus restrictions I do not have any photos of people, so I used what was within my reach. Empty beer bottle (that was a really good one - won world beer competition in its class in London 2019). This is shot fully open. 55 would show internal flare, but here I basically see none. I’m very pleased with the outcome. I basically cannot say otherwise because I already sold the 55. 8)
Second shot is taken at f2. Pretty sharp. :)
I will try to use it for portraits as soon as possible.
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Looks like you got a very good copy ! Enjoy.
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Congrats !
This is a shot with the latest version of the 55 f/1.2 ;)