NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Lens Talk => Topic started by: stenrasmussen on August 27, 2015, 12:22:34
-
With actual measurements too. Apart from its CA department not bad at all.
https://photographylife.com/reviews/nikon-noct-nikkor-58mm-f1-2#more-116770
-
The stats show the noct beats the 58g by an ample margin in sharpness i but once had the occasion to shoot with the noct, cheapest copy in the market is some €2500 at least.
-
Sten, many thanks. With rarity and price I think I will have to be happy with the 58 1.4G (which I am :) ) . I can always dream of finding one in some out of the way shop where the owner doesn't know what he has .. lol
Tom
-
Thanks for finding and sharing Sten.
The test seems to differ a lot from this one:
http://www.photozone.de/nikon_ff/883-nikkorafs5814ff?start=1
Re shrapness values overall and sharpness values for mid and corener are much more even. But I don't know how they measure preciesly or why there is such a huge difference.
I don't really see that much difference between the old Noct Nikkor and the new 58mm 1.4... Except maybe the old Noct had more of an even field curvature...
-
Do I understand correctly that peak performance at f=4 is due to
sensor characteristics of the D810 and that peak performance might
be found at f=5.6 for a D600 or F=8 for a D3?
-
No, I belive that is a wrong assumption.
-
I thought the Diffraction limit of the sensors do override the
resolution limit of the lens which might well be at f=4.
So if it was at f=5.6 the smaller pixels might see the peak at f=4
anyway.
As discussed earlier the absolute value of a higher res Sensor
will still be higher than that of a lower res sensor at same aperture.
-
I thought the Diffraction limit of the sensors do override the
resolution limit of the lens which might well be at f=4.
So if it was at f=5.6 the smaller pixels might see the peak at f=4
anyway.
As discussed earlier the absolute value of a higher res Sensor
will still be higher than that of a lower res sensor at same aperture.
I'm positive that we have debated this at length in the past. The only way for a sensor to shift the peak of the resolution curve (as a function of aperture), is for the sensor-only MTF function to depend on the aperture of the lens. If you're willing to assume this, you can end up with a peak at f/4 with camera A and a peak at f/5.6 with camera B. Personally, I think the assumption is very unrealistic, plus I have never seen measurements which would lead me to conclude that it is needed. For all intents and purposes, the sharpest aperture of a lens is the same over a very wide range of sensors. Higher-res sensors are therefore expected to give a boost (however small) in resolution at all apertures, and we do not expect the existence of a "diffraction-limited" aperture beyond which there is no resolution increase whatsoever (leaving aside the effects of focusing errors and camera shake which may mask small gains in resolution).
-
What is there to compare?
One is a night and stars lens and the other is a portrait lens.
One is a collector item and the other is an artsy/fartsy item.
One is manual and the other is AF.
I have both and don't use either. I got the Noct for my collection many years ago and got the 58G because there was a special offer this summer at J. Lewis for GBP999 less VAT, you do the math.
For my type of work, they simply don't cut. Unfortunately, I have limited time to indulge in artsy/fartsy photography and frankly I would rather use the Leica R 50/60. It trashes all 50 focals across all brands.....and I do not do brick walls or IMA test.
-
Why would one opt for a mistress if there is a beautiful wife yearning for you at home?
These Nikkors put you in a similar, but perhaps easier solvable, quandry.
Enjoy both. Or stick to the one you have available. Or dream on.
(killing a couple of waiting hours at Frankfurt International enroute to S.A.)
-
As Paul Newman would say: "Why fool around with hamburger when you have steak at home?”
45P rules 8)
-
The 45 P is nice enough, but it lacks the magic of the Noct. Besides, it's way too tiny for my hands.
-
Get on that plane! ::)
There are probably dozens of great normal lenses out there (45-60mm). Probably the most of all focal lengths...
-
Did I mention? I like the 1.8/50g .... hahahah
Thank you Simone. Convincing argument!
-
If I remember correctly, the aspherical surface is the front side of the second element, not the first one.
EDIT: my memory betrayed me. The review is correct.
-
If I remember correctly, the aspherical surface is the front side of the second element, not the first one.
The Noct-Nikkor has first element ASPH
The new; First and # 6...
-
Heres a third take on sharpness while we are at it,,,
https://photographylife.com/reviews/nikon-58mm-f1-4g/3
Not that it matters much, the overall rendering is THE most important and I just love both of them for that, if in doubt just buy one of each, keep both or the one you like the most and if it's the old one get a CPU from Bjørn for it ;D 8)
-
Heres a third take on sharpness while we are at it,,,
https://photographylife.com/reviews/nikon-58mm-f1-4g/3
Not that it matters much, the overall rendering is THE most important and I just love both of them for that, if in doubt just buy one of each, keep both or the one you like the most and if it's the old one get a CPU from Bjørn for it ;D 8)
Doctor. Frankly, the only thing I like about the 58G is the Sombrero effect which makes it a near perfect portrait lens (not headshots). I do not care about the peripherals for Beauty/Fashion shots.
As for the Noct. It is nicely sitting pristine in it's box unused.....sad but such is the situation.
I am not in favour of the 58G Bokeh and prefer the Noct. The 58G has both cateyes and onions Bokeh which is not to my liking.
-
Almass, I think we have established what you dislike here...
I have only seen onion rings in oof highlights on very few images from the new 58 1.4 when provoked, so I can live with that and the cast eyes appearing at the corners for some oof renderings :)
PS I don't shoot beauty/fashion... ;)
-
casual shot Df 58@1.4 iso 3200, no tampering
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5641/20324492264_c26e3ba3ba_b.jpg)
-
The softening from diffraction is real, and can be seen in the aerial image. To me, the resolution vs. diffraction debate becomes moot once the photo is locked in to a reproduction size. It either has the desired impression of sharpness at the given display size/resolution, or it doesn't.
I have a particular 50mm that is amazingly un-soft at f/22,.....IF the print is small.
-
I think this stuff is very subjective. I love to use the 58/1.4 AF-S but recognize that sometimes the cat's eyes look a bit odd. Most of the time I love its out of focus rendering. I use it for portraits (of adults and children) and events.
I would not be able to use a manual focus lens wide open reliably for low light event photography but with an autofocus lens (the 58/1.4) I get good results in this context. I love its colours and contrast and overall "feel" of the image. It is also significantly less expensive than the f/1.2 Noct.
-
I had an opportunity to buy a Noct Nikkor some 10 years ago, but passed on it as I found the image quality on a D2x being way too soft, way too chromatish aberrationish and way too low in contrast. Two years ago I had a strike of luck on eBay and managed to nail one for a 3-digit number, other bidders apparently were scared by the external look that showed years of press photo use. Seller promised that despite rough looks lens surfaces are pristine, and so they were.
I really was pleasantly surprised by how good detail even wide open in the center was. Field curvature is crazy with this lens but who gives a damn - it's really fun to be able to shoot hand-held at 1/200s even at twilight. The previous copy I tried must have been in need of CLA I was told, because the local lens service wizard I employ taught me that the lens helicoid (it focuses by moving all of the assembly back and forth) has to be aligned to infinity properly, otherwise the lens will show softness, vignetting and CA at closer distances despite nailing focus (weird?)
1200x800 does not give justice to the detail in these images, but perhaps the illustration is still worth it. I shot this series in my old neighborhood, anticipating moving to another district of Helsinki. I wanted to put this up on the wall in our new apartment but our interior architect in charge (Mrs. Vilhelm) decided that the wall in my mind was to be occupied by 15 polaroid-sized instagram prints in frames [silent cursing].
So now I have this adorning my studio workspace wall. All shot with a Df at ISO 12,800 1/200s f/1.2
-
I just adore the mood in these pictures. Lovely! :)
-
If Brassai was shooting Paris night scenes today, he'd have that camera and that lens.
-
These are beautiful pictures Vilhelm! Awesome night shots - Thanks also for your reviews of the SL Apo Lanthars. I'll try to add some pictures to the threads.
I also managed to get an Ai-s Noct but spent about US$1800 - expensive but compared to current prices perhaps 'reasonable'. I try to put it into perspective with my friend's Leica Noctilux at $12000 and the new AF-s 58mm at the same price.
The Noct is unique - the rendering is quite different from the Haruo Sato duo of the 35mm and the AF-s 58mm which is also special and unique. For my run and gun type of street shots, I don't have enough skill to get things in focus with the Noct so the AF-s 58mm gets more in focus. But the Noct pictures are always special. I have traveled with it as my only lens and although magical at f1.2 is also sharp, contrasty with high micro and macro contrast and Apo like at f4 and f5.6
D700 and Df @ f1.2