NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => What the Nerds Do => Topic started by: richardHaw on July 21, 2019, 05:24:30
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https://richardhaw.com/2019/07/21/repair-new-nikkor-135mm-f-2/
I love this lens a lot! :o :o :o
chromatic aberration seems a bit high but it can be avoided, mostly. ::)
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To be precise, yours is the AI 135mm f/2 :) :o
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To be precise, yours is the AI 135mm f/2 :) :o
The ser. No. 179161 suggests that it could be one of the very late K version converted with the appropriate Ai kit. According to your website. ::)
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(https://live.staticflickr.com/5534/12017564226_ebdcf29aac_c.jpg)
One heavy beast! ;)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7349/12070654243_6f45499c74_o.jpg)
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Richard, your reviews are a good read - very informative, as they try to capture the characteristics of lenses (and illustrate them), instead of providing pure "metrics".
Lots of good sample shots too.
Also, nice picture by Fons, wide-open I guess. The blur circles look perfectly smooth, which explains in part the quality of the bokeh.
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Wide open, indeed Airy.
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To be precise, yours is the AI 135mm f/2 :) :o
yes, as Akira said. it's K according to your amazing site :o :o :o
another collector pointed out that this is the rarest one since K weren't made in large numbers ::)
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Wide open, indeed Airy.
nice photo! :o :o :o
i can see some chromatic aberration but i guess thats the signature of this lens.
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The ser. No. 179161 suggests that it could be one of the very late K version converted with the appropriate Ai kit. According to your website. ::)
You are absolutely right! However it is AI, not an AI converted "New Nikkor" (K). It is not the first time I have seen native AI lenses with K serial numbers.
- the focus grip is like an AI lens, the grip on the K version is more finely divided, and slightly darker/glossier
- it has the maximum aperture index post, at about 6:30 o'clock on this image. Only AI lenses have this:
(https://richardhaw.files.wordpress.com/2019/07/img_1335-2.jpg)
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You are absolutely right! However it is AI, not an AI converted "New Nikkor" (K). It is not the first time I have seen native AI lenses with K serial numbers.
- the focus grip is like an AI lens, the grip on the K version is more finely divided, and slightly darker/glossier
- it has the maximum aperture index post, at about 6:30 o'clock on this image. Only AI lenses have this:
Roland, thank you for the details. If I understand correctly, the function of the aperture index post is rather an afterthought. It was originally added to the aperture ring to interlock with the EE control unit DS-12 for F2AS.
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The Maximum Aperture Indexing post is not the small tab on the aperture ring which engages the EE control unit for the DS-12. The Maximum Aperture Indexing Post is part of the rear lens protector - on the picture above it is the part which sticks out just above the circled screw at the bottom.
On pre-AI lenses the rear protector is often a simple rim which goes 360° around the rear element. On some lenses the lower section is higher for extra protection.
On AI lenses (including AI-S, AF) the rear protector only covers the top half of the lens, with a short post on the bottom half somewhere around 6:00 - 6:30 o'clock. The precise position of this tab signals the lens maximum aperture to certain cameras which have a feeler at the bottom of the mirror box. The Nikon FA uses this to determine the lens maximum aperture, needed for matrix metering. Other cameras from the same period used it for flash metering. Only a handful of cameras use this feature.
The maximum aperture indexing post is the sure way to know the lens is native AI and not AI converted.
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The Maximum Aperture Indexing post is not the small tab on the aperture ring which engages the EE control unit for the DS-12. The Maximum Aperture Indexing Post is part of the rear lens protector - on the picture above it is the part which sticks out just above the circled screw at the bottom.
On pre-AI lenses the rear protector is often a simple rim which goes 360° around the rear element. On some lenses the lower section is higher for extra protection.
On AI lenses (including AI-S, AF) the rear protector only covers the top half of the lens, with a short post on the bottom half somewhere around 6:00 - 6:30 o'clock. The precise position of this tab signals the lens maximum aperture to certain cameras which have a feeler at the bottom of the mirror box. The Nikon FA uses this to determine the lens maximum aperture, needed for matrix metering. Other cameras from the same period used it for flash metering. Only a handful of cameras use this feature.
The maximum aperture indexing post is the sure way to know the lens is native AI and not AI converted.
Now I remember that. Thank you, again, for the detail!
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Glad to see you finally got this lens, I asked you about a couple of years ago and you said it was on your radar as a highly valued acquisition and it appears your copy is also almost mint. I have the Ais version and I love it as well. It is a bokeh machine as Fons horse picture testifies. I notice the helicoid threads on yours was very clean. My focussing is really stiff, was yours also or is it just because the lens body is so heavy? Thanks in advance, Gerry
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The Maximum Aperture Indexing post is not the small tab on the aperture ring which engages the EE control unit for the DS-12. The Maximum Aperture Indexing Post is part of the rear lens protector - on the picture above it is the part which sticks out just above the circled screw at the bottom.
On pre-AI lenses the rear protector is often a simple rim which goes 360° around the rear element. On some lenses the lower section is higher for extra protection.
On AI lenses (including AI-S, AF) the rear protector only covers the top half of the lens, with a short post on the bottom half somewhere around 6:00 - 6:30 o'clock. The precise position of this tab signals the lens maximum aperture to certain cameras which have a feeler at the bottom of the mirror box. The Nikon FA uses this to determine the lens maximum aperture, needed for matrix metering. Other cameras from the same period used it for flash metering. Only a handful of cameras use this feature.
The maximum aperture indexing post is the sure way to know the lens is native AI and not AI converted.
maybe this is a franken lens :o :o :o
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Glad to see you finally got this lens, I asked you about a couple of years ago and you said it was on your radar as a highly valued acquisition and it appears your copy is also almost mint. I have the Ais version and I love it as well. It is a bokeh machine as Fons horse picture testifies. I notice the helicoid threads on yours was very clean. My focussing is really stiff, was yours also or is it just because the lens body is so heavy? Thanks in advance, Gerry
hello!
the focus shouldnt be stiff, but the focus throw should be quite long :o :o :o
it needs to be serviced probably.
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On further analysis of your lens, I see that the focussing ring sactually sits up from the chrome ring about 3/8" and it moves away from the chrome ring as it focusses. The Ais lens doesn't't do this, it stays with in 1/16" from the chrome ring the hole focussing distance. Hopefully this doesn't change the disassembly to much? It's like yours has double helicoid like the 105 f4 macro? Just an observation ??? Gerry again :)
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maybe this is a franken lens :o :o :o
It does have an interesting mix of early and late features:
- serial number belongs to K series
- AI style grip and AI max aperture post
- engraved LENS MADE IN JAPAN in white, found in K and very early AI lenses
- aperture coupling prong is from pressed sheet metal - usually found after engraving changed to MADE IN JAPAN in black
These AI lenses with early serial numbers often have a mix of features like this. I suspect Nikon kept some K serial numbers for spares, or never got round to using them before the AI series started, and decided to use them on production AI lenses at a later stage. I have seen this on a number of other lens models such as the 20/4 and 28-45/4.5.
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but the focus throw should be quite long
On my 135 Ais lens it's only 190 degrees from 1.3 to infinity. The Ai lenses were alway longer or rather more gradual.(finer thread) :)
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It does have an interesting mix of early and late features:
- serial number belongs to K series
- AI style grip and AI max aperture post
- engraved LENS MADE IN JAPAN in white, found in K and very early AI lenses
- aperture coupling prong is from pressed sheet metal - usually found after engraving changed to MADE IN JAPAN in black
These AI lenses with early serial numbers often have a mix of features like this. I suspect Nikon kept some K serial numbers for spares, or never got round to using them before the AI series started, and decided to use them on production AI lenses at a later stage. I have seen this on a number of other lens models such as the 20/4 and 28-45/4.5.
must be a prototype :o :o :o
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but the focus throw should be quite long
On my 135 Ais lens it's only 190 degrees from 1.3 to infinity. The Ai lenses were alway longer or rather more gradual.(finer thread) :)
if it bothers you so much just send it to me lets see what i can do, Ai-S right? :o :o :o
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https://richardhaw.com/2019/07/21/repair-new-nikkor-135mm-f-2/
I love this lens a lot! :o :o :o
chromatic aberration seems a bit high but it can be avoided, mostly. ::)
in the 1980ies I was tempted to buy one of these used for my FM2n at the time. The seller offerd this and the 2.8/135 as well. The 2.8/135 was in excellent condition, sleek amd small, the 2/135 was extremly heavy, more than double the price and in medium good used condition. I was tempted but went for the 2.8 ... Happy hauling and shooting, Richard!
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I checked the records in my database - lenses in the "New Nikkor" (K) series have serial numbers 175011up to a recorded high of 179779, for a total of at least 4769 units. Most that I have seen after 178xxx are actually AI, so a significant proportion are not actually the K version. The original K version would be quite rare.
For more reading on this lens, this is very interesting: https://imaging.nikon.com/history/story/0030/index.htm
:)
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I checked the records in my database - lenses in the "New Nikkor" (K) series have serial numbers 175011up to a recorded high of 179779, for a total of at least 4769 units. Most that I have seen after 178xxx are actually AI, so a significant proportion are not actually the K version. The original K version would be quite rare.
For more reading on this lens, this is very interesting: https://imaging.nikon.com/history/story/0030/index.htm
:)
So this is actually an Ai? i am now confused :o :o :o
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in the 1980ies I was tempted to buy one of these used for my FM2n at the time. The seller offerd this and the 2.8/135 as well. The 2.8/135 was in excellent condition, sleek amd small, the 2/135 was extremly heavy, more than double the price and in medium good used condition. I was tempted but went for the 2.8 ... Happy hauling and shooting, Richard!
it's the best in terms of cost/performance. :o :o :o
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So this is actually an Ai? i am now confused :o :o :o
As you know, the AI series officially starts at 190001, the original New Nikkors have serial numbers from 175011 - 179779. These versions are almost identical optically and mechanically, apart from a few minor changes for the AI version:
- AI aperture ring
- Different rear lens protector, AI version has max aperture indexing post
- New Nikkor rubber focus grip is glossy black, AI is dark grey matte and less finely knurled
There might be some internal changes or improvements along the way but that's about it.
It turns out that many lenses with New Nikkor serial numbers are actually AI - they were built as AI and are not AI converted. I have seen this with many lens models including the 20/4, 35/1.4, 135/2 and 28-45/4.5. I guess Nikon had left over parts with K serial numbers that they decided to use up after AI production started. So yes, your lens is actually AI :) :o
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As you know, the AI series officially starts at 190001, the original New Nikkors have serial numbers from 175011 - 179779. These versions are almost identical optically and mechanically, apart from a few minor changes for the AI version:
- AI aperture ring
- Different rear lens protector, AI version has max aperture indexing post
- New Nikkor rubber focus grip is glossy black, AI is dark grey matte and less finely knurled
There might be some internal changes or improvements along the way but that's about it.
It turns out that many lenses with New Nikkor serial numbers are actually AI - they were built as AI and are not AI converted. I have seen this with many lens models including the 20/4, 35/1.4, 135/2 and 28-45/4.5. I guess Nikon had left over parts with K serial numbers that they decided to use up after AI production started. So yes, your lens is actually AI :) :o
thanks, so this is actually an Ai in disguise :o :o :o