NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Camera Talk => Topic started by: Frank Fremerey on October 07, 2017, 05:20:30
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Hi all, I just received a message by one of our members that I should post more insights on the D850.
Yet I feel I already posted most of my insights.
She is what I wanted and does as expected for the price I was ready to pay. In the end a camera is just a piece of hardware. Do not expect wonders from a tool, expect wonders from a craftsman.
Most of the pictures I posted to the forum are D850 or D500 just because these are the cameras I use for daily work and play.
I have no emotional relationship to my tools other than I am angry when a tool does not do as expected. The D850 delivers. Good tool. She doesn't stand in my way and does not add anything I do not want. She is reliable and she is better than the cameras she replaced for me, the D600 and D3.
Only thing I hate is the focussing screen, so I use her to AF and the AF works well.
If you have any more questions, please ask and I will happily answer.
PS I do not video, so I cannot talk about that
PPS I did not try stacking, did not ask for the feature either
PPPS I found myself in the DXO test. Like I said one month earlier the most amazing thing is color differentiation at base ISO. It is immediately visible, I do not need fancy tools to measure "color depth"
PPPPS A 100% crop from my most recent "roll"
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Any idea how it compares with the Df/D4 in low light (3200, 6400 ...) and in dynamic range? I like that I can almost always salvage an image even in bad light. My only other firsthand comparison, the Canon 5DS R, seems to require either perfect light or low ISO.
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I have no emotional relationship to my tools other than I am angry when a tool does not do as expected. The D850 delivers. Good tool. She doesn't stand in my way and does not add anything I do not want. She is reliable and she is better than the cameras she replaced for me, the D600 and D3.
I don't know, Frank. You've assigned a gender to your hardware, there must be some emotional relationship there :o
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I don't know, Frank. You've assigned a gender to your hardware, there must be some emotional relationship there :o
I do not believe in gender. ;-)
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Any idea how it compares with the Df/D4 in low light (3200, 6400 ...) and in dynamic range? I like that I can almost always salvage an image even in bad light. My only other firsthand comparison, the Canon 5DS R, seems to require either perfect light or low ISO.
For technical questions refer to: https://www.dxomark.com/nikon-d850-sensor-review-first-dslr-hit-100-points
I have neither the tools not the knowledge to measure these and I do not have or want a Df/D4 to compare. I also think that a 46 Megapixel Camera and a 16 Megapixel Camera can only be sensibly compared using same size large prints.
I already told you my subjective impression, that the D500 requires less high ISO chrominance noise filtering than the D850, that the noise character of the D500 is more luminance, less chrominance than the D850. But this is just my daily work and your milage may vary. I do thus not consider the D850 sensor a huge step forward from the D500 sensor when it comes to ISO performance.
It is much better in the low ISO color rendition and the spatial resolution over the whole frame (I capture more information in 46 Megapixels than in 21).
The view finder is for my practical puposes a tad worse than the D500 VF and I use them side by side every day.
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As for focus stacking, the D850 is great. In fact, I only use LiveView and I set it to silent and Electronic Front Curtain. There is no mirror slap and the layers for stacking very fast and quiet. I just watch the LiveView screen be updated as a way of knowing each frame has been taken. Never been easier. Here is a stacked image with the APO El Nikkor 105mm mounted on the Cambo Actus.
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As for focus stacking, the D850 is great. In fact, I only use LiveView and I set it to silent and Electronic Front Curtain. There is no mirror slap and the layers for stacking very fast and quiet. I just watch the LiveView screen be updated as a way of knowing each frame has been taken. Never been easier. Here is a stacked image with the APO El Nikkor 105mm mounted on the Cambo Actus.
Beautiful, just beautiful!
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Here is another: Nikon D850, APO El Nikkor 105mm on the Cambo Actus.
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I guess the focus stacking question is concerning the AF-S-Auto-focus-shift?
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I guess the focus stacking question is concerning the AF-S-Auto-focus-shift?
Not for me. No interest in this since all of the best lenses don't work on it.
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Hi Frank, thank you for providing info on the D850. I wonder if you, or anybody else here, have tried/used the in-camera conversion of negative film? I'm still waiting for the camera, but I am curious about how this actually works, particularly since I have a large shelf with negative albums. Any insights would be welcome.
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I have ordered the battery compartment as well as the ES2 I will test negative conversion as soon as the ES2 arrives.
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The wait over here is for an l-plate. Lloyd Chambers (www.diglloyd.com) fully endorses the 2-piece RRS BD850-L (even before he had a camera available to test it, go figure). However it requires the left strap triangle-shaped wire with plastic insert to be removed, making it a useless pita for people like me who do remove the plate on longer missions without a tripod.
Apparently RRS has listened to the many complaints about this, and has announced a single piece D850 l-plate called BD850-UL that doesn't require the strap to be removed. Much better and on order.
As expected, the Foolography BT dongle with D800 modification fits well into the 10-pin connector; together with a BT GPS mouse a GPS tagging solution that actually works, something that cannot be said about SnapBridge. Nikon BTW needs to be pressed to implement direct BT support for BT GPS mice.
I bought a Bad Elf GPS Pro+ GPS mouse; it allows to be simultaneously connected to more than one camera. it also has a GPS tracking mode making it possible to merge GPS data to files of my (GPS-less) Fuji's after ingesting. It also has the possibility to remotely trigger the Nikon through the BT connection, also a handy feature.
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Maybe RRS could finally eliminate the idiotic requirement to have a hex key in order to attach and remove their various plates while they're improving that L-plate? Too much to ask, probably...?
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Maybe RRS could finally eliminate the idiotic requirement to have a hex key in order to attach and remove their various plates while they're improving that L-plate? Too much to ask, probably...?
+1
A simple slot for a coin or a small collapsible lever is all that is needed.
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That might not give enough torque to attach the plate securely enough, with a hex key you can get it really tight. On the other hand if it starts to get loose it would be easier to tighten again. I was on a 4 day hike once when the QR plate on my camera started to loosen, and I had no hex key. I managed to keep the plate tight enough using various implements, but it was frustrating. I always keep a hex key in my camera bag now :)
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Maybe RRS could finally eliminate the idiotic requirement to have a hex key in order to attach and remove their various plates while they're improving that L-plate? Too much to ask, probably...?
The strength of the head would be compromised by a slot. It's a simple enough fastener that a different fastener can surly be fond. I'd use only stainless steal. I don't know much about stainless steal grades. YMMV.
I'd look for a "key" style hex tool one might carry on a key ring. Note to self: look for such a tool to replace an Allen wrench for use in the field.
Dave Hartman
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Here is the key...
5/32 hex Dogging Key. (https://www.rbadoor.com/panic-hex-key-5-32-x-2-1-8-long.html)
There may be a more elegant device but this one will fit on one's key ring and serve tighten and remove retaining screws for RRS camera L-brackets, Wimberley P-10 ~ P50 lens plates and probably most similar Arca-Swiss brackets and plates.
One on the key ring, one in the camera bag, one in the glove box of your car or truck and you'll be all set.
Dave
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Maybe RRS could finally eliminate the idiotic requirement to have a hex key in order to attach and remove their various plates while they're improving that L-plate? Too much to ask, probably...?
The new L-plate from RRS seems to have a slot for a hex key:
(http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/assets/images/products/Nikon-D850.1%7C1%7C1-04.jpg?resizeid=2&resizeh=400&resizew=400)
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The new L-plate from RRS seems to have a slot for a hex key:
(http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/assets/images/products/Nikon-D850.1%7C1%7C1-04.jpg?resizeid=2&resizeh=400&resizew=400)
Yes, but this L-plate requires the left strap wire with black plastic insert to be removed from the camera straplet, at least if one wants the vertical part flush against the body. Not funny at all for people like me who remove the L-plate on a regular basis.
There is another L-plate announced without this annoyance, but also without the hex key insert:
(http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/assets/images/products/Ultralight-L-Plate-for-NIKON-D850.main-01.png?resizeid=6&resizeh=1000&resizew=1000)
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The Novoflex multi-tool is quite handy: 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6mm hex keys, slot screwdriver, cross-slot screwdriver and Torx T25.
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The Novoflex multi-tool is quite handy: 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6mm hex keys, slot screwdriver, cross-slot screwdriver and Torx T25.
If I did the math right 5/32" = 3.97mm.
Dave
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If I did the math right 5/32" = 3.97mm.
Dave
Using Inch keys for Metric hexagon fasteners is absolutely not recommended and should be avoided! You will either ruin the key, the screw or both.
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Using Inch keys for Metric hexagon fasteners is absolutely not recommended and should be avoided! You will either ruin the key, the screw or both.
Are you saying the 5/32" or 4mm hex key is not really the size it is designated as? If the 5/32" key is really 3.97mm then it's only 0.03mm under size.
Dave
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Due to how Mechanical Engineering works it's always about tolerances,,, You can't judge such measurements based on Nominal values.
The interesting measurement from the strength point of view is the Edge measurement not the Size especially with the now almost obsolete hexagon shape, now splines are used instead since they are far superior especially because of the Edge being so critical but also since the resist wear much better - Anyway,,,
The Edge tolerances are the factor, if you look up these you will find that worst case Edge for Metric key S min is 3,95mm and in an Metric screw it is a difference of 4.58 - 4.44 mm = 0.14mm ie it wobbles a little but it works,,,
For an Inch key S=4mm, the minimum is 3.9mm and in an Metric screw the Edge measurement worst case is; 4.58 - 4.40mm = 0.2mm of missing material!
The difference is thus about 0.06mm
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The wait over here is for an l-plate. Lloyd Chambers (www.diglloyd.com) fully endorses the 2-piece RRS BD850-L (even before he had a camera available to test it, go figure). However it requires the left strap triangle-shaped wire with plastic insert to be removed, making it a useless pita for people like me who do remove the plate on longer missions without a tripod.
And to think that I modified my D800 L-bracket to also attach to the strap loop hole on the left :)
Yes it is more elaborate to remove but it does provide additional support rather than just attaching to the bottom of the camera
I did it because my D800 chassis broke where the bottom plate is attached with 4 little screws and I do not want to rely only on my repair to hold any torsion on the camera while mounted on the tripod, wonder why this is done for the D850
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Based on only my own limited experience with hex head fasteners, they would be my last choice for strength and durability.
The slot in a well-made stainless steel or other high grade steel screw provides for more than enough tightening torque.
Take a look at the fasteners used on the Sachtler head removable QR plate used for heavy $100,000 cinema cameras with $150,000 lenses attached: Slot head screws, usually 2.