NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Camera Talk => Topic started by: CS on April 27, 2017, 15:12:08
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I'm thinking about replacing my D200 with a D7200. no, it's not a D500, but it's only half the price of a D500, which matters to me. I've never used Live View, so can I rely on that to focus my 105 2.5 ais, or is that not a good solution? With my shooting eye suffering from macular degeneration I have to now use my right eye, and really need all of the AF I can get. Maybe Live View is a help there on the D7200, I dunno.
The D7200 appears to draw high praise, although 24 MPs will probably kill the use of my 18-200 and 12-24, so they will need to be replaced also. Being retired and living on a fixed income means that i need to spend wisely, so I want to hear what the folks here think before I do something that I'll later regret.
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I think that a D7000 series upgrade from a D200 will be quite the revelation for you - in MANY ways.
I would not discount the current lenses you have. I'm using a Nikon 18-140 on the D500 and it works quite well. If you do get the D7200, test out your current lenses first, making sure to AF fine tune them (if necessary) and see how they fair. I'm guessing they will do better than you think. A lot of people put way too much emphasis on MTF charts. Don't let them intimidate you about your current lenses.
A bigger issue in higher MP cameras is going to be shooting technique. Be as stable as possible, use VR when needed. The D7200 AF system should be plenty good for most people. Honestly, when I upgraded from the D300 to a D500, it wasn't about the AF being an issue. It was about the fact that the D300 was an aging body, met it's end of life for my business use and a higher usable ISO for lower light shooting. The improved AF was just an added bonus.
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Hi, Carl! In some respects, the D7200 is still the best machine even today. Try E-Bay, you may got it for $750-800, from the very respectable sellers, brand new, with full USA warranty. Just be patient. Your 18-200 and 12-24 will serve you very well, do not make any rush, try them first. In my experience, both of those lenses will deliver even better resolution on D7200 sensor. Good luck! LZ
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I'm thinking about replacing my D200 with a D7200. no, it's not a D500, but it's only half the price of a D500, which matters to me. I've never used Live View, so can I rely on that to focus my 105 2.5 ais, or is that not a good solution? With my shooting eye suffering from macular degeneration I have to now use my right eye, and really need all of the AF I can get. Maybe Live View is a help there on the D7200, I dunno.
Live view works great for focusing if your camera is on a tripod and the subject doesn't move much. For hand held shooting, I don't think it's so very practical. To focus, you need to zoom in the image and then you don't see the whole frame so composition can drift while you're focusing if the camera is not fixed in position.
Have you tried using the manual focus confirmation dot? I find it works well when focusing the 135/2 Zeiss.
The D7200 appears to draw high praise, although 24 MPs will probably kill the use of my 18-200 and 12-24, so they will need to be replaced also. Being retired and living on a fixed income means that i need to spend wisely, so I want to hear what the folks here think before I do something that I'll later regret.
I don't think there will be any problems using the 12-24/4 on a D7200, though I haven't used that specific combination. 24MP DX can be excellent if your lens is up for it but the image quality doesn't become worse just because you increase the number of pixels - generally speaking in the worst case it can stay the same, or most likely become better as long as you view the final image at the same size and from the same distance.
The 18-200mm also should not be worse on a D7200 than it is on a D200. I think it is always good to remember what the final print or presentation size is instead of worrying too much about the individual pixels. Still, if you're unhappy with the 18-200 on the D7200, there are now some alternatives e.g. you could get a 18-140 which has been recommended (I have not used it though); I would stay away from the 18-105 as that lens I don't like though. The older 16-85 is reasonably good and there is also a newer, but more expensive 16-80 with a faster maximum aperture. The Nikon professional 17-55/2.8 DX is suprisingly inexpensive in the used market and it is an excellent lens you may want to consider, if you can find a nice clean copy which hasn't been banged around. You may need some fine tuning of the AF to make the best of this lens.
I know it is more expensive but the 70-200/4 Nikkor is an outstanding lens which I really like a lot, it gives a very pleasing image, is lightweight, and you can shoot it wide open without any significant drawbacks. Focusing is excellent as well.
The D7200 AF system should be a revelation, coming from the D200. :)
So money permitting I would perhaps replace the 18-200 with the 17-55/2.8 Nikkor used and the AF-S VR 70-200/4 if you find one available at a suitable price. I would keep the 12-24/4. If these are too expensive then perhaps some lenses with smaller apertures would be suitable, but I would first try to find these lenses used.
I think the D7200 will be seen as a classic due to its balanced feature set and image quality.
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Whatever your choice might be you are going to be in for an enormous bump in IQ, ISO and Dynamic Range :)
The D200 was my first DSLR and did many things right but could never please me in the ISO department, remember accidentally shooting an early landscape at ISO 400 which caused a lot of green noise destroying the image completely. Also remember taking bracketing shots because the DR performance was a joke.
Both are now issues of the past with current cameras broadening the ability to explore new ventures beyond expectations.
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Unless something unforeseen happens t will probably be a couple of days before I buy. We're heading out of town for an overnight stay very shortly. So, when we get back I'll have more time to look into it, Meanwhile, I am appreciative of the responses so far, very helpful. :D
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I use the old 105/2.5 on 36mpx without problems, so I guess that it should work fine on the d7200 ;)
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I use the old 105/2.5 on 36mpx without problems, so I guess that it should work fine on the d7200 ;)
It's not the MPs that give me problems with that lens, it's focusing it with the lousy D200 viewfinder. FX viewfinders are better for it, which is why I'm interested in Live View with a DX body.
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I agree with the rest - you are going to LOVE a new camera. Quite an upgrade - go for it
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It's not the MPs that give me problems with that lens, it's focusing it with the lousy D200 viewfinder. FX viewfinders are better for it, which is why I'm interested in Live View with a DX body.
I thought you were afraid that the old AIS lenses did not give sharp images on the higher pixel count cameras.
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The confirmation focus dot works well enough on the D800+105 f2.5, I would think it will also work well on the D7200
You'll be blown away with the raw files from the D7200 vs what you get with the D200
The higher resolution does need better technique when shooting handheld in order to get sharp images
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Carl, you should enjoy your D7200. The AF system shared with D750 is very good. The camera is much lighter than D200 and is thus less burdensome to carry.
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Live view for focusing hand held works but as Ilkka notes it's not particularly practical. I've used it a few times to focus a 20/2.8 AIS. I really needed a tripod but I could not use one where I was. I've setup my D800 so I press the center button in the multi-selector to change form the full frame to 100%. It's a toggle so pressing again moves back to full frame. Using Live View while hand held with a longer lens like a 105mm at 2-3 meters probably would not work due to DoF. Anyway it worked with the 20/2.8 and it was a bit of a pain.
Dave Hartman
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For reasons I have not entirely figured out, of a large number of old manual lenses I've used on a D3200 and a D7100 (whose finder is much like the D7200, and vastly better than the 3200), the 105/2.5 is one of the easiest to focus. I don't know why this is, but I find it easier to get sharp than a similar age 85/1.8 or a 135/2.8, and a good bit easier than any 50. For some reason the ancient 200/F4 is also fairly easy to hit. I would not worry prematurely. Try it first.
If you really have trouble, the DK-21M magnifier can help a little, though it reduces eyepoint so that you can't wear glasses, and must mash your eye pretty well in to get the full frame. I used that routinely on the D3200, but have not bothered on the D7100, as I notice little difference. On the D3200, whose positive diopter only goes to +.5, the added positive diopter was very helpful, but on the D7100 and 7200 it goes to +1, which is all right.
I had to change eyes a few years ago after an accident actually changed my dominant eye in a split second. It takes some getting used to, but it can be done.
I have just recently gone to a D7100, after my wife upgraded to the 7200 mostly for the better buffer, with the added high ISO capability along for the ride. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
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Carl, you should enjoy your D7200. The AF system shared with D750 is very good. The camera is much lighter than D200 and is thus less burdensome to carry.
Less weight is to carry around is appreciated.
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Some good info here, thanks to all that responded.
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I agree with all the above. I started with the d200 in 2007 and it has been quite a trip since. Even the jump to a d300 was a major one. As of today and depending in the type of photography you do and your needs, if price-weight-IQ are concerns I will seriously consider a second hand d600 or d610.
I have been using the d750 -same sensor- for some time and has been amazed by the quality of the files it produces. 24mp full frame and very reasonable prices.
I hope it helps.
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Just bought a new D7200 in January just before leaving for 2 months in Spain. This was after deciding that I was not going to spring for a D500 & needed something to shoot sports with high ISO capability. After arriving in Spain I shot Malaga CF in early February using the Nikon 70-300 AF VR
see the results here https://zing-graphics.smugmug.com/frame/slideshow?key=mfb9Jc&autoStart=1&captions=0&navigation=0&playButton=0&randomize=0&speed=3&transition=fade&transitionSpeed=2&clickable=1
I also used it with the old kit lens 18-55 VR & an old 24-120 f3.5 AF
I came from D200 - D300 - D700 - D3S so getting used to the D7200 was not a problem.
I also use several MF Nikons & have no problem focusing with any of them on the viewfinder (not using LV but I have fairly good eyes)
Good luck
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I'm just scared of Nikpn's refurbed stuff right now. the refurb price on the D7200 is good but the reviews are not all that good. A lot of bodies didn't function correctly which could present a hassle that I'd rather avoid for the price difference. B&H throws in SanDisk 16GB Extreme SDHC UHS-1 card and small bag with the new one.
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I have a D7200 and I'm very pleased with it. For me it's basically an improved D7000, with the improved buffer being very much appreciated. As for refurbished units, it's true that B&H has a rating of just 3 out of 5 on them. However, there are only three reviews, and the two negative reviews are by the same person who posted similar info both times, apparently for the same purchase.
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The warranty with refurbished Nikon products is only 90 days. I bought a refurbished AF-S 24-85/3.5-4.5G ED VR and the VR was dead which is probably the reason the lens was returned in the first place. Some people have good luck with refurbed but I won't try it again. If Nikon was confident of the refurbished products it sells they would give a one year warranty.
Some sellers other than Nikon may give a longer warranty on Nikon refurbished products.
Dave Hartman
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I agree with all the above. I started with the d200 in 2007 and it has been quite a trip since. Even the jump to a d300 was a major one. As of today and depending in the type of photography you do and your needs, if price-weight-IQ are concerns I will seriously consider a second hand d600 or d610.
I have been using the d750 -same sensor- for some time and has been amazed by the quality of the files it produces. 24mp full frame and very reasonable prices.
I hope it helps.
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I agree with all the above. I started with the d200 in 2007 and it has been quite a trip since. Even the jump to a d300 was a major one. As of today and depending in the type of photography you do and your needs, if price-weight-IQ are concerns I will seriously consider a second hand d600 or d610.
I have been using the d750 -same sensor- for some time and has been amazed by the quality of the files it produces. 24mp full frame and very reasonable prices.
I hope it helps.
What about a D610 from KEH.com? I've had good luck buying from KEH and their warranty is 180 days.
Dave
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What about a D610 from KEH.com? I've had good luck buying from KEH and their warranty is 180 days.
Dave
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FX presents a lens replacement issue requiring more funding to accomplish. Plus, as I read things, the D7200 has capabilities that are advanced beyond those of the D610.
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FX presents a lens replacement issue requiring more funding to accomplish. Plus, as I read things, the D7200 has capabilities that are advanced beyond those of the D610.
I was just looking at eBay and buydig, and with any sort of reliable encouragement, I just might buy from them @ $749. I AM ready to order, and I will also grab an RRS L plate for the D7200. Add to that any bargain lens deals that get my attention.
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Adorama has the D7200 on their website for $759, a price that B&H would not match, BTW. So I call Adorama just now, a little chatting, and I get the D7200 for $719! 8)
B&H did sell me the RRS L bracket though....
Now, I'm of two minds over lenses, so I think I'll take the advice of Ilkka and others, and hold off on buying any until I see how my 18-200 and 12-24 do with 24MPs. Of all things, something I had not considered, Thom Hogan doesn't think that my 50mm's are gonna be good enough. Sheesh! I will have to see that for myself, but the 35mm1.8 DX is not expensive.
So, I'm off to Costco to grab an SDHC card, or maybe two.
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It's a very good price and also d7200 is a very good camera
I recently upgrade from d7000 and I have to say that I rediscovered my Nikon 18-70 3.5-4.5 that showed much better on the new camera (every lens I put on this body looks better, the Sharpening algorithms do a very good job) so give a try on your lenses
I also use 50 1.8 G that is an excellent lens just from the f 1.8 and also 35 1.8 DX a very good lens that became my standard
Enjoy
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"What a revolt'in development!"
As I feared, the news is not good. My D7200 refurb arrived today, and it was missing the strap, which is no big deal. so I called Adorama while waiting for the battery to charge, and they agreed to ship out a strap. But, that was a preview of things to come. So once the battery was charged and I stuck it in the camera, and discovered that the door on the built in flash will not open. This is one of the more common issues with this body I'm told. Anyway that's enough for me to return it and get my money back.
Now, I'm in a quandary over the D7200. If I buy new my odds of getting one without problems are much better.
Adorama is currently closed, so I can't call them about returning the camera until tomorrow, which means that I don't know what they will offer to keep a sale while getting this body back in return.
Costco has the D7200 bundled with the 18-55, 55-300, extra battery, 32GB SDHC card, SD card wallet, case, Costco $5 coupon, and an extra year of warranty on the body making it 2 years instead of one for $1350, plus $115 tax. That would solve some of my concerns about lenses up to the 24 MP sensor size, but the lenses don't have good build quality. Maybe that wouldn't matter, as I'm very careful with my gear,. but, I don't know if my good care is enough to warrant buying this bundle.
I'm open to opinions, so let's hear 'em.
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I think if you can get it bundled with the 18-140 you'd be better off. It's a good match for the body. Both B&H and Adorama have that for about $1300.
The 55-300 is not a bad lens, but it's slow to focus, and tends to hunt. Mine will often go all the way to one end and come back, in order to find focus if it's not pretty close to start with. For a bit more money the 70-300 VR focuses almost exactly twice as fast, does not hunt, and it's better made, with non rotating front element and a manual focus override.
I'd consider getting the camera and kit zoom new, and looking for a used bargain in a telephoto. Examples of either the 55-300 or the 70-300 (making sure it's the right one, not the cheap G version) can be found at places like KEH.com. My wife just got a nice clean copy of the latter from KEH for $328. If you really like the 55-300, it can be had for under $250 like new.
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The lenses with the Costco bundle don't interest me. I'm put off by the plastic bayonet on the 18-55mm. Adorama let's you create your own bundle. The 18-140mm zoom range would be more interesting to me. I've rally liked my friend's AF-S 16-85/3.5-5.6G ED VR DX or maybe the newer 16-80/2.8-4.0 lens so...
I'd pass on the Costco bundle. I'd get the lens or lenses you really want.
Dave Hartman
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I think if you can get it bundled with the 18-140 you'd be better off. It's a good match for the body. Both B&H and Adorama have that for about $1300.
The 55-300 is not a bad lens, but it's slow to focus, and tends to hunt. Mine will often go all the way to one end and come back, in order to find focus if it's not pretty close to start with. For a bit more money the 70-300 VR focuses almost exactly twice as fast, does not hunt, and it's better made, with non rotating front element and a manual focus override.
I'd consider getting the camera and kit zoom new, and looking for a used bargain in a telephoto. Examples of either the 55-300 or the 70-300 (making sure it's the right one, not the cheap G version) can be found at places like KEH.com. My wife just got a nice clean copy of the latter from KEH for $328. If you really like the 55-300, it can be had for under $250 like new.
I am mulling over the D7200/18-140 bundle deal, and throwing in a used 70-300 AF-P DX VR form KEH. OTOH, Adorama might make me an offer I can't refuse, although I won't be taking any more Nikon refurbs. I knew better, yet still ordered one, which just shows you how addled one can get.
Can I assume that the the 70-300 DX you got was the new AF-P model? That 16-80 is just out of my reach now.
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I won't be taking any more Nikon refurbs. I knew better, yet still ordered one, which just shows you how addled one can get.
I did fine with two Nikon body refurbs, but that's a small sample size. I've also had several Canon refurbs with no problem, except for the one body that had a dead battery (which I'm sure was the reason for the original return).
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The 16-80/2.8-4.0 DX is well out of my reach.
Dave
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I am mulling over the D7200/18-140 bundle deal, and throwing in a used 70-300 AF-P DX VR form KEH. OTOH, Adorama might make me an offer I can't refuse, although I won't be taking any more Nikon refurbs. I knew better, yet still ordered one, which just shows you how addled one can get.
Can I assume that the the 70-300 DX you got was the new AF-P model? That 16-80 is just out of my reach now.
No, the 70-300 DX we got (actually my wife, not me, to go with her D7200) was the older AFS VR version. Still a goodly step up in quality from the 55-300, though optically not much different.
The 16-80 is awfully expensive, and the 16-85 is pretty hefty too. The 18-140, though not a great deal when bought separately, is a pretty good one in a bundle.
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No, the 70-300 DX we got (actually my wife, not me, to go with her D7200) was the older AFS VR version. Still a goodly step up in quality from the 55-300, though optically not much different.
The 16-80 is awfully expensive, and the 16-85 is pretty hefty too. The 18-140, though not a great deal when bought separately, is a pretty good one in a bundle.
Thanks, Matthew. IME, KEH gives their gear a more thorough look than Nikon refurbs get. Not only that, they give double the warranty period. Since I have a 12-24 f/4 (if it actually up to the 24MPs of the D7200), I would not really need the 16mm end of the 16-80 to shoot wide. Well, wide isn't really wide with DX, but you know what I mean. ;D
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Okay, the D7200 refurb is heading back to Adorama, and I ordered a new D7200 w/freebies, got a bundle discount on the 70-300 AF-P, got a hood for it (doesn't come with one), and I threw in a Sigma 17-50 f/2.8. Now, I have a new body coming with some decent lenses for24MPs. Should be here Monday. 8)
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Okay, the D7200 refurb is heading back to Adorama, and I ordered a new D7200 w/freebies, got a bundle discount on the 70-300 AF-P, got a hood for it (doesn't come with one), and I threw in a Sigma 17-50 f/2.8. Now, I have a new body coming with some decent lenses for24MPs. Should be here Monday. 8)
My uneducated guess is that you're going to be very happy. Enjoy.