NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Camera Talk => Topic started by: richardHaw on August 02, 2016, 17:29:16
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OK, i have done the ritual.
1: raise tab
2: set to non-AI in the menu
3: set to A
4: press the preview button
but this thing would not stop-down meter :o :o :o
my manual Nikons would give me a shutter speed reading ::)
am I doing something wrong?
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It doesn't work that way. The procedure is convoluted and has to be done correctly.
First, flip up the aperture follower (remember to set it back later !!)
Make an entry for a non-CPU lens if not already done, and mark it as non-AI.
Now, use the front dial to set the aperture to a value, say f/5.6. Rotate the aperture ring on lens to the same setting.
Then, either shoot in A or M, for the latter mode, you match deviations from "0" as normal by changing exposure speed.
There is no "stop-down metering" at all using the non-AI lens in this manner. Nikon does not allow it for any lens operated either via CPU, aperture follower, or by the procedure just outlined above. In fact, using the preview button disconnects the meter.
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It's much easier to use AI converted lenses ...
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True. And putting a CPU in them makes their use even more easy.
My aim was to have all my Nikkors (100+) CPU-modified and at present this goal has been achieved. Only kept two Nikkors in their non-AI condition for testing purposes (50/2 and 105/2.5).
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i see. damn it,Df...
i had somebody forward this concern to the engineers at Nikon via facebook. hope it gets a FW update so we can use it like the F3 :o :o :o
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No chance. Nikon has been adamant regarding stop-down metering for many years. They will not allow it unless the lens lacks any aperture linkage and has a preset or direct-set aperture. Period.
I have discussed the topic with Nikon reps several times to no avail.
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this is for non-Ai lenses by the way :o :o :o
the person that I talked to (a bar buddy of prof Goto) said that they are aware of the complaint for some time now.
I do not exactly know what he means by that. it can be that they are aware and doing something or wanting to do something but they cant (because it's messed up). i am still hopeful. anyway, I am going to ask directly as to why they cant do it on the Df ::) im sure that im going to get alibis ::) i just want to see how far they will go and if they will tell the truth.
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The "problem" that won't go away, and the underlying reason for Nikon not allowing stop-down metering, is the aperture linkage. AI vs non-AI is a minor consideration, that's all.
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Stop down metering is possible with AI-compatible cameras if there is no aperture linkage to the lens. That's how the old Nikkor-T 10.5cm 1:4 works. For most other lenses however, you'd need to remove the aperture stop-down lever, which rather restricts their use.
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My point, exactly. There is an inherent conflict between stop-down metering and the lever that keeps the aperture wide open. That is why Nikon never will allow this, unless the mechanical linkage is not present.
The only exception is of course with an E lens such as the PC-E models having their own preview control, because the camera "knows" that the preview lever is pushed in. The view in the finder then shows the stopped-down image, but the meter read-out stays put.
Metering at the wide open aperture is the preferred method anyway, as it is potentially the most accurate and sensitive.
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still not sure why it is possible with film cameras but not on digital :o :o :o don't know if i am stubborn or what but it just doesn't make sense to me. for now I am treating the Df as a non-metered camera
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Nikon follows their own logic re stop-down metering. Was always possible, would be possible even on digital, but is blocked.
Non-AI metering on the Df is a real breeze if you do it correctly and follow the instructions to the dot.
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I've wondered if Nikon's refusal to allow stop down metering is a support issue.
My first camera, a Nikkormat FTn and lens a 55/3.5 Nikkor-P Auto used stop down metering with the supplied Nikon M2 tube. It's so easy it's ridiculous. Then again there is nothing stopping one from using hand held meters. I shot B&W film almost exclusively with Pentax spot meters. My second camera was a Nikon F with a standard un-metered prism and the third was a Nikon F2 also with a standard prism.
I'm quite surprised the Df doesn't offer simple, old time, pure stop down metering.
Dave
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Even my Canon T90 did that. I do stop down metering with the Df - using the old PC lenses, by the way.
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Does any current Nikon have a stop down that is truly mechanical - i.e. will work with power off?
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Does any current Nikon have a stop down that is truly mechanical - i.e. will work with power off?
i dont think so :o :o :o
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FM10 (but you could argue it's not a Nikon since it is made by Cosina :o )
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It has always been my suspicion that the reason Nikon disabled stop-down metering in the electronic cameras is that they are afraid of the resulting disappointment on the part of inexperienced operators when the normal full-aperture reading and the stopped-down reading don't exactly match. The two readings never did on the Nikon film cameras I had.
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I would suspect that Nikon does not allow stop-down metering because the amount of light necessary to meter is reduced and the relative amount of the stray light entering from the viewfinder starts to affect the meter.
Set the camera to A mode, put the cap on the lens and switch the direction of the viewfinder ocular between darker and brighter areas. You will see the shutter speed selected by the camera jumping around. That's the sole reason for the eyepiece shutter.
I think the ocular is normally covered reasonably well by the head of the photographer, but the ocular would be covered less optimally if the photographer wears glasses, which should make the stop-down metering more inaccurate.
Obviously the mirrorless cameras are immune to this problem, and thus there's no problem with the stop-down metering.