NikonGear'23
Gear Talk => Camera Talk => Topic started by: Hugh_3170 on February 18, 2016, 06:07:44
-
I have just spotted this release by Pentax / Ricoh: http://www.dpreview.com/news/5348800158/here-at-last-ricoh-unveils-the-pentax-k-1-full-frame-dslr
The camera has a 36 MPx 135 format sized sensor.
-
Thanks for the direction.
I wonder how the cable of the "flexible tilt" screen is connected to the body. Judging from one of the product images, a normal FPCB seems to be used. I wonder if it is a safe means...
-
so happy to see pentax back on track. please let pentax live. i hope that they dont go belly up! :o :o :o
i went to their showroom last weekend with my family and found out that it is just a simple office with a gallery in the floor below. this company deserves more than this. would i buy a pentax? maybe...
-
With my initials on the front it must be meant for me...
-
The camera certainly looks nice. However, I become a little uneasy when reading about all the stuff that is supposed to move around inside. How long will that technology last?
Another interesting question is about what lenses are available to the camera, and how good they are with this level of camera resolving power. A comprehensive native lens line does not come into existence over night - nor is it cheap to develop from scratch. Of course you can use adapters and third-party lenses, but much of the desired feature set of a modern camera is lost that way and who wants to boast they have reverted to the '50s for features? (this with the caveat I really don't know what gear Pentax offers at present).
-
i have talked to their rep and he told me that you can use most of the older K mount takumar lenses :o :o :o
-
But will they function with 100% of features? AF, light metering, aperture automation? EXIF feedback?
-
I did notice, after going through the long spec sheet, that the camera supports GPS and in fact has a GPS device built-in. Now, that's something in favour of the camera. Still I wonder why the other major players waited so long to recognise GPS as an important feature of their camera systems. Nikon's support for GPS goes back 15 years or so.
-
That pull out screen looks so funny :o Otherwise a nice looking camera, I agree with being sceptical about using 'old' lenses on this one,,,
-
i am guessing that it's the same as how modern nikons can support ai-d nikkors :o :o :o
(http://www.bdimitrov.de/kmp/technology/K-mount/K.gif)
looking at the image, it does seem that the overall schematics is not too different from the F mount apart from the positioning of the parts.
this looks very promising. i hope that pentax gets it right this time and rise again. i have always loved pentax but company and brand stability has always turned me off. their support is also not as good as nikon from where I came from. will i buy one? not sure. but the takumars are selling from $5 each over here and some of the older takumars are pretty good themselves. i always love the underdog.
-
by the way, just like how you need to ai convert older Nikkors, you also need to shave something from some older takumars (baffles). :o :o :o
im not a pentax expert so i do not know which one needs to be circumcised (!?) but i know some of my friends do that
-
Richard, we need to get you into Chipping your Ai and Ais Nikkors - Being able to fully use these on modern cameras - I'm sure it would be the ultimate satisfaction for you ;D
-
This is about as distant time span you can match Nikon components, yet still use with wide-open aperture metering and complete EXIF data. Nikon D3X with Nikkor-Q 25 cm f/4 (early '50s) + N-F ring (1959). The latter contains the CPU.
-
The looks of this camera are so reminiscent of the old Pentax 6x7...
The 1795$ asking price for the body alone seems truly very competitive, if it will help to make it a huge success is doubtful however.
-
The looks of this camera are so reminiscent of the old Pentax 6x7...
...
That was my first thought as well, the Pentax 6X7 was a very nice but very big SLR though ;)
Nice one Bjørn ;)
-
The Pentax 6x7 was very big indeed, very nice and truly unique.
I still have fond memories of my first SLR, an Asahi Pentax Spotmatic F. It had a M42 screw-thread lens mount with a nifty construction to enable open-aperture metering and it came with a rather good 55mm F/1.8 Takumar. After the acquisition of a Nikon FE in 1979 however I sold it and never felt the need to look back.
-
I think Pentax crowd is healthier than Nikon's... nobody is whining/complaining about 36MB, as everybody did when D800/810 saw the light
Also skeptical about all moving parts...
-
Additional info pages:
http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/k-1/feature/
Reading through these pages it certainly seems like a VERY thought through camera. I like what I see.
-
The explanation of how moiré is "prevented" is a pipe dream. Interpolation does not create moiré, it is caused by insufficient resolution. A slight blurring does help, but then there has to be some loss of resoulution. There is no free lunch even in the Pentax world.
-
All this features seem to be innovated for the jpeg-shooter. This pixel shift feature can be saved as a RAW-file and "DEVELOPED IN CAMERA". Who does that? Seems like a fine camera though. Always liked the feel of a Pentax in the hand. If the files are as nice as the 645z RAW-files, everything is just pure joy :)
-
Apparently there are almost no native lenses available that also allows the entire 24x36 frame to be used. Mounting the APS-C lenses will switch the camera into APS-C mode, meaning over half of those 36 MPix aren't used at all. All you get is 15 MPix ...
-
Apart from the lack of an EVF it looks like a very nice camera. Built in image stabilizer looks very useful. Pentax has shown an ability to make nice primes before without making them oversized. Now they need to do that once more!
-
I think the more prudent approach would be to have a selection of lenses first before launching the camera that really needs them .... The Pentax development team certainly has a massive challenge ahead to address and solve quickly if the new camera is going to be successful.
At least Pentax has an optical illustrious past thus we probably won't see a repetition of the Sony labours here.
-
Lenses are needed and perhaps the Pentax lens department has a number of lenses coming soon. All in all I'd say it's good to see good ol' Pentax back in the "full estate" game.
What they can brag about is build quality...they are at least as tough as Canikon's offerings. They even rate their cameras to -10°C which the others keep a 0°C low limit.
-
Olympus also rate the OM-D E-M1 at -10 C.
Pentax, Sony and Olympus has used IBIS for several year now, so that should be a proven technology by now.
Pentax K-1 is the first full frame camera to offer pixel shift, to achieve full RGB readout in raw. This is a feature previously used by Olympus and in medium format backs to counter moire. Since this feature requires a multi shot approach and repeated cycling of flash units, it is useful in a studio only. It helps avoid Bayer atifacts for photography of fabrics and for repro work.
-
I wonder if their: Pixel Shift Resolution System can produce a short-cut route to amazing B&W images,,,
Reinforced with the SR (Shake Reduction) mechanism, the K-1’s Pixel Shift Resolution System* captures four images of the same scene by shifting the image sensor by a single pixel for each image, then synthesizes them into a single
-
i am guessing that it's the same as how modern nikons can support ai-d nikkors :o :o :o
(http://www.bdimitrov.de/kmp/technology/K-mount/K.gif)
looking at the image, it does seem that the overall schematics is not too different from the F mount apart from the positioning of the parts.
this looks very promising. i hope that pentax gets it right this time and rise again. i have always loved pentax but company and brand stability has always turned me off. their support is also not as good as nikon from where I came from. will i buy one? not sure. but the takumars are selling from $5 each over here and some of the older takumars are pretty good themselves. i always love the underdog.
Likely there is going to be the same mechanical/electronic limitations as for their APS-C bodies. A number of lenses are going to cover the whole frame, most noteworthy the famous limited lenses, which are fully compatible although with screw drive focusing.
Chipping older Pentax lenses looks a lot more challenging though as the contacts are protruding through holes in the mount. Image of mount down on this page:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/pentax-k3/pentax-k3TECH.HTM (http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/pentax-k3/pentax-k3TECH.HTM)
The question then becomes if whole mounts with contacts can be purchased, and be transplanted to the older K-mount lenses.
Some older nikon lenses are known to mount (upside down!) on some of the APS Pentax bodies, the mechanical design of the mount itself is that similar. I assume that can be a risky business if one does not know what one are doing. As I recall they may then meter in stop down mode.
-
Later Pentax APS bodies also have the innovative Astrotracer feature that are meant to replace the equatorial small trackers - works by combining advanced GPS/compass features with sensor shifts. http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/review/pentax-astrotracer-review-astrophotography-made-easier/ (http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/review/pentax-astrotracer-review-astrophotography-made-easier/). I have seen examples/reports that it works quite well, if not at the levels one can get out of the best portable trackers.
-
This camera should also work with Pentax's library of 645 and 6x7 medium format lenses.
-
Indeed, I had the SMC 67 400mm f/4 ED IF what a monster! 3.700 kg waht a fantastic lens,,, on film
-
I think the point of using medium-format lenses is moot. They still are not native in the meaning that basic functions such as AF, aperture automation etc. will work. Why should the past be the hope for the future? It is fun to use exotic lenses on any camera, but for day-to-day bread & butter shooting, you need the seamless integration only native lenses can provide.
If anyone thinks I'm stating the opposite of what I have published for the Nikon Df with older Nikkors, rethink twice. Here the lens behaves exactly as it did when it was launched. The Df behaves like any Nikon SLR, but uses digital capture technology instead of film. Metering and automatic aperture just work like they did in the 'old' days. (If a CPU is added, even more features can be extracted for the benefit of the DSLR age, but these are mainly features of convenience rather than touching the basics. Film had no way of recording EXIF ...).
-
I agree these huge 6x7 or even 4x5 lenses are not for mounting on the new K1 except for the fun of it, they where huge! ;)
-
My point exactly. But of course, we are ever so often ready to enjoy all the fun we can get :D
-
Lest anyone thinks otherwise, I really wish the new Pentax to be successful. We need an broadening of the playing field of top-drawer digital cameras.
Hopefully the third-party makes such as Sigma and Tamron will be able to retool and bring out fully K-1 compatible lenses from the various lens liens they already have in production.
-
Sorry for the off topic!
K1,,, I was already thinking how nice will the next upgraded version be,,, then shivers came from within,,, K2
'K2' the Savage Mountain in Karakoram, remote peaks between Pakistan, India and China where we have lost so many skilled climbers,,, back in the 80's where I was climbing a lot it was always frighting when news arrived from K2,,, :'( :'( :'( 1986 - 13 lost in one season
-
Voigtlander 125 comes in K-mount, right?
How long will they be available?
-
No idea how many of them were made, but the total must be severely limited. If I recall correctly, < 2000 were made in F mount. I assume the K version would be less frequent.
There is, however, always the circumvention method by using another Voigtländer in K-mount to serve as a mount host. Erik is an expert in this field.
-
A huge point for me is battery life. With my Df I always carry 2 batteries and they are rated 1400 shots on the CIPA-test. The K-1 is rated 760 on the same test. It doesent sound very impressive, but I guess all the features suck the power out the batteries pretty fast.
-
After 2 years of using the Df, always a spare battery, the amount of shots on a single battery have significantly reduced.
-
Strange. My Df just happily purrs on and the battery apparently lasts forever. I do have spares though, as I usually combine Df with my IR-modified D5300, and the latter is really fond of eating batteries. (they both use EN-EL14a).
Still, the D5300 isn't king. The mirrorless Sony A7 is my worst battery consumer ever. Three freshly charged batteries might not keep the camera voracious appetite at bay for more than a day in the field.
-
This drains battery:
Live view
VR
AF and AFS
Chimping
-
Lenses are needed and perhaps the Pentax lens department has a number of lenses coming soon.
The new Pentax 15-30 is likely a remodeled Tamron 15-30 - specifications are very similar, same number of elements/groups. Haven't seen any optical schematics to confirm this however.
-
Did no one notice the LEDs that can be used to light up the back of the camera or the one on the front lighting up the mount for lens changes in the dark?!?
(http://www.dpreview.com/files/p/articles/7158808396/K-1_P9_assistlight_mount_1_on.jpeg)
That alone would be insanely handy for me. I may just do some research on the focus screen options and F mount adapters for this camera, I could probably swap over from my D750 with minimal expenditure. Will be keeping an eye on this camera for sure.
-
A sure-fire method of showing any shy subject where you are ....
Using Nikkors on a Pentax will hardly provide you with full automatic functionality?
-
Not an issue I would be running into. Fumbling with lenses in the dark I have many times however. I carry a headlight with me typically, but would sure be nice to not need to put it on just to change lenses. IBIS would be fantastic as well.
While I love Nikkor lenses, I am a nomad when it comes to bodies. If my Nikkors can work on it, I'm game. Having IS for them would fantastic.
-
I had a reality awakening when I tried to use my Sony A7 with non-native lenses. It simply doesn't work well. Won't fall into that trap again.
-
Adapting Nikon lenses on Pentax won't be worth the hassle, since the two systems have almost identical flange distance, Pentax maybe a milimeter shorter than Nikon. You'll lose all automation.
-
Losing automation doesn't bother me. Looking into it just a bit, it appears the necessary adapters use an element in them, scratch that.
Hopefully Nikon or Canon offer some non-sensor/af innovations in the bodies to come. I really like what Pentax has done with this one.
-
Did no one notice the LEDs that can be used to light up the back of the camera or the one on the front lighting up the mount for lens changes in the dark?!?
That alone would be insanely handy for me. I may just do some research on the focus screen options and F mount adapters for this camera, I could probably swap over from my D750 with minimal expenditure. Will be keeping an eye on this camera for sure.
i noticed that as well, it is all over the body. :o :o :o
i still think that the D4's implementation is still the best (back-lit buttons) but that would make things expensive ::)
what if they just put glow in the dark paint instead? i know it sounds dumb but at least it's cheap and is not over bright to annoy anything.
-
Later Pentax APS bodies also have the innovative Astrotracer feature that are meant to replace the equatorial small trackers - works by combining advanced GPS/compass features with sensor shifts. http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/review/pentax-astrotracer-review-astrophotography-made-easier/ (http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/review/pentax-astrotracer-review-astrophotography-made-easier/). I have seen examples/reports that it works quite well, if not at the levels one can get out of the best portable trackers.
that's so smart :o :o :o
-
Yeah, a lot of nifty things in this body Richard. I wouldn't want glow in the dark pain though. First, it needs to be exposed to light to charge which won't do any good for cameras in a bag. Second, I don't want my camera to always be illuminated. Besides, LEDs are extremely cheap.
-
Yeah, a lot of nifty things in this body Richard. I wouldn't want glow in the dark pain though. First, it needs to be exposed to light to charge which won't do any good for cameras in a bag. Second, I don't want my camera to always be illuminated. Besides, LEDs are extremely cheap.
i am pretty sure that it is not as powerful as the one on the picture (we will see in CP+, i will cover it). :o :o :o
if it is we can just put tape to dim it down.
i still think that somebody should at least experiment with the glow in the dark thing. i just do not know if these pigments will last.
the only turn off for me on this camera is the dial for scene modes. it could have been shutter speeds ::)
this is a step in the right direction by pentax and in the classic pentax way of giving ugly but very capable cameras ::)
-
...the classic pentax way of giving ugly but very capable cameras ::)
XD Ha! Reminds me of the Minolta 7d I switched from the d70 to. Man was it ugly, but it was nice having IBIS.
-
OK talked to a long time pentax user. yes, the K mount is compatible with older lenses and should perform the same regardless of the body that it was mounted to. he is using older takumars with his APS pentaxes now with no problems so far. :o :o :o
M42 screw mounts can also be easily adapted but will lose some features (aperture lever?)
-
Many lenses are only supported with stop down metering though; http://www.dpreview.com/news/7158808396/worth-the-wait-a-look-inside-the-pentax-k-1?slide=12 (http://www.dpreview.com/news/7158808396/worth-the-wait-a-look-inside-the-pentax-k-1?slide=12).
-
Many lenses are only supported with stop down metering though; http://www.dpreview.com/news/7158808396/worth-the-wait-a-look-inside-the-pentax-k-1?slide=12 (http://www.dpreview.com/news/7158808396/worth-the-wait-a-look-inside-the-pentax-k-1?slide=12).
i think it is saying that it is possible for those lenses to produce usable pictures when stopped down a bit :o :o :o
must be the vignetting issue
-
Not "vignetting issue" as such, rather a too small image circle by design. These lenses were never intended to project an image circle large enough for FX/24x36.
From the similar experience of DX Nikkor to FX Nikons, while you get a larger image circle by stopping down (for some of them), image quality outside the designated format coverage tends to be very poor. Again, hardly surprising and nothing one can hold against a given lens.
-
I think the point of using medium-format lenses is moot. They still are not native in the meaning that basic functions such as AF, aperture automation etc. will work. Why should the past be the hope for the future? It is fun to use exotic lenses on any camera, but for day-to-day bread & butter shooting, you need the seamless integration only native lenses can provide.
If anyone thinks I'm stating the opposite of what I have published for the Nikon Df with older Nikkors, rethink twice. Here the lens behaves exactly as it did when it was launched. The Df behaves like any Nikon SLR, but uses digital capture technology instead of film. Metering and automatic aperture just work like they did in the 'old' days. (If a CPU is added, even more features can be extracted for the benefit of the DSLR age, but these are mainly features of convenience rather than touching the basics. Film had no way of recording EXIF ...).
I hope I will be forgiven for drifting slightly off-topic and qualifying your last point. You cannot record EXIF in film by definition. However, the Nikon F6, the Canon EOS 1v, and a Minolta model do record shooting data and with the right cable and software this data can be extracted, saved on your computer, and linked to the scan of your picture. I do that with my Canon 1V and whilst it is not the most practical of approach, it does the job.
Albert
-
I had something similar running on my F5. Extremely impractical by any standards.
-
APS film had a magnetic strip that would carry some EXIF information, but that was APS...
-
Some cameras can imprint exif in between the exposures? I think i saw something like that before in a catalogue a long time ago :o :o :o
-
Some cameras can imprint exif in between the exposures? I think i saw something like that before in a catalogue a long time ago :o :o :o
Databacks? :D
-
You could imprint date and a [very short] fixed text between the frames. Hardly what we understand by EXIF today ...
Yes, the F5 needed a special data back.
-
I had a databack for the Nikon F801s, and that is the first and last databack I've ever owned. A far cry away from modern EXIF for sure.
-
yes, data backs. i was thinking of the term and was so sleepy that digital back is the one in my mind but thats for hasselblads :o :o :o
the one that i saw is not for nikon (might be maxxum). i remember commenting to my friend that if he gets that camera then i dont have to jot down his exposure settings on the notebook and i am free to flirt with the models ::)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CavQykgW1oc
tony's video. he's videos are OK but sometimes he doesnt have a clue about what he is talking about or is just confused presenting them. check it out.
-
Here are some images to examine the effects of the pixel shifting feature. I layered them in PS to toggle between at 100% and wow! The difference is pretty amazing all over. In some areas, like the red fabric, it is an immense improvement. I hope this feature, along with the LEDs, make it into the newer Nikons!
http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/k-1/ex/img/ex-pic05_off.jpg
http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/k-1/ex/img/ex-pic05_on.jpg
-
I am a rare bird around here.
For my birds in flight, and fast action sports photography I use two Nikon D7100s. These cameras with fast Nikkor telephotos are simply outstanding.
For my serious landscape/nature photography, I was an early adopter of the Pentax K3ii APS-C camera. It was the first Pentax camera to come out with high resolution/pixel shift mode. It must be used on a tripod, and can only be used if the subject does not move (even a gentle wind will result in ugly artifacts). However, the K3ii 24mp camera (when used to shoot a motionless subject in the pixel shift mode) will produce images that rival the results obtained by a Nikon D810.
The new Pentax K1 full frame camera has an new updated version of pixel shift that is claimed to allow one to photograph objects that move! This is truly revolutionary "if it works". In the next month or two we'll all see comparisons of the Pentax K1 pixel shifted images to the D810 and even to medium format digital cameras. If the new K1 version of high res pixel shift works as advertised, the K1 may just be the best landscape/macro/nature DSLR ever made.
Actually, I have nothing to complain about when it comes to lenses that I can use on the K1 full frame. Pentax currently has about 80 lenses ( http://www.pentaxforums.com/lenssearch/?inproduction=0&format=ff&focusing%5B%5D=af ) that you can purchase new that are high quality and cover a full frame sensor. Also, there are literally millions of old MF and autofocus older Pentax K mount lenses out there that will also fit and operate nicely on the new Pentax K1 full frame camera. As for me, I'm a fan of manual focus, and already have purchased 5 Zeiss ZK lenses and 3 Voigtlander (Cosina) lenses that I intend to use on my K1 when it arrives in April or May.
-
going to cover CP+ and i hope that i get to see and molest this camera long enough to write a short review :o :o :o it is going to be filled with old japanese grandpas again for sure ::)
-
Bruce, I well remember the splendid Pentax LX film SLR camera that came out not long after the also excellent Nikon F3. I have always personally felt that the LX was superior to the F3, but the F3 had that slight market lead and it "took off".
I certainly wish the K-1 and Pentax/Ricoh every posible success. High end competition in the 24x36mm/135 format sector will not only be great for Pentax shooters, but it will keep the pressure on Canikon & Sony to innovate and be competitive.
As an aside, it will be interesting to see how many existing Pentax 645D users also adopt the K-1.
I am a rare bird around here.
For my birds in flight, and fast action sports photography I use two Nikon D7100s. These cameras with fast Nikkor telephotos are simply outstanding.
For my serious landscape/nature photography, I was an early adopter of the Pentax K3ii APS-C camera. It was the first Pentax camera to come out with high resolution/pixel shift mode. It must be used on a tripod, and can only be used if the subject does not move (even a gentle wind will result in ugly artifacts). However, the K3ii 24mp camera (when used to shoot a motionless subject in the pixel shift mode) will produce images that rival the results obtained by a Nikon D810.
The new Pentax K1 full frame camera has an new updated version of pixel shift that is claimed to allow one to photograph objects that move! This is truly revolutionary "if it works". In the next month or two we'll all see comparisons of the Pentax K1 pixel shifted images to the D810 and even to medium format digital cameras. If the new K1 version of high res pixel shift works as advertised, the K1 will be the best landscape/macro/nature DSLR ever made.
Actually, I have nothing to complain about when it comes to lenses that I can use on the K1 full frame. Pentax currently has about 30 lenses that you can purchase new that are high quality and cover a full frame sensor. Me, I'm a fan of manual focus, and already have purchased 5 Zeiss ZK lenses and 2 Voigtlander lenses that I intend to use on my K1 when it arrives in April or May.
I shoot both Nikon and Pentax now. I expect that in time some of you will too.
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvCxb17LIwo
nice video. :o :o :o
-
What lenses that have natural K mounts for Pentax are really sharp and well-corrected?
-
The Limited 31mm and 77mm f/1.8 lenses are generally highly regarded. My brother is a Pentax shooter and those are his most used lenses; however do not expect APO correction. They do cover full frame.
-
The Limited 31mm and 78mm f/1.8 lenses are generally highly regarded. My brother is a Pentax shooter and those are his most used lenses; however do not expect APO correction. They do cover full frame.
I wonder if there are any that are fast, sharp wide open, and well-corrected?
-
Correction, it should be FA 77mm f/1.8, fixed above.
-
Two small facts that i know:
1. The Pentax M42 screw mount is adaptable(with correct infinity focus) to the K mount. I had some of these back in
the 1980's.
2. In the first few years of the Zeiss ZF/ZE series lenses, they were also offered in K mount(ZK) and M42 mount(ZS).
The list may include the 21/2.8, 25/2.8, 35/2, 50/1.4, 50/2 Macro, 85/1.4, and the 100/2.
-
Thanks Sten!
Then you buy the Ultron i mentioned but in M42 mount and switch the mount onto the APO Lanthar and use a M42 to K-mount adapter on it
-
The Pentax manual focus 85/1.4 has a very good reputation, but I doubt it is APO corrected.
The Pentax 200/4 macro is also highly regarded. It is an ED lens so should be well corrected, don't know to what level though.
Both of them are Pentax "star" lenses, this designation was given only to their premium lenses.
-
This thread should really be split. The majority is no longer K-1 discussion, but Michael's mount issue. Which is interesting and certainly deserves it's own thread in the lens or nerd sections.
-
This thread should really be split. The majority is no longer K-1 discussion, but Michael's mount issue. Which is interesting and certainly deserves it's own thread in the lens or nerd sections.
I disagree. I can stop talking about the mount issue, but it is a real issue for those with other lenses. I suggest leave it. I will start another thread if I need to talk about the mount issue further.
-
I have already acted per Tristin's suggestion as it was a good one ....
The place to continue (adapting lenses etc.) is over at 'Lens Talk', where the relevant parts of this thread have been assembled into a thread of their own.
The current thread should remain focused on the camera itself and its features.