Author Topic: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes  (Read 16612 times)

MILLIREHM

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #15 on: April 12, 2017, 12:11:30 »
Glad that the D500 is existing and that I have got one.
It appears to be not favorable but consequent that different from its preceding 7xxx models the 7500 now has removed the Non CPU support (like 3xxx and 5xxx). Still no AF-DX primes though.

I am in doubt that this body will be commercially successful - as badly needed by this company, we will see.

Certainly it would be disappointing if 100 years anniversary doesnt show more new stuff than this body and limited D5/D500 collectors series in different color
Wolfgang Rehm

simsurace

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2017, 12:11:39 »
They must have done one of their incredibly well-designed surveys and concluded that almost none of the users of D7xxx bodies use old lenses.   8)
Simone Carlo Surace
suracephoto.com

ōivind TÝien

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2017, 12:43:06 »
Well it cannot go in my camera bag ...one SD slot at a wedding ..suicide...20 mp ...thats half way back to a D7000 ..no thanks

5568 compared to 6000 horizontal pixels is only 7.2% decrease in linear resolution, hardly a deal breaker.
ōivind TÝien

BjÝrn RÝrslett

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2017, 12:44:18 »
They must have done one of their incredibly well-designed surveys and concluded that almost none of the users of D7xxx bodies use old lenses.   8)

That wouldn't hardly be surprising ...

Fortunately the D7500 supports GPS. That is something.


stenrasmussen

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2017, 13:04:11 »
IMO these days people should be happy as long as Nikon survives. 100th Anniversary ought to mean a new camera model but so far nothing points in that direction. Maybe the 125th will bring modern tech  ;D

Frank Fremerey

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #20 on: April 12, 2017, 13:34:57 »
Most important news: no 20k AF but the old 3500DX
You are out there. You and your camera. You can shoot or not shoot as you please. Discover the world, Your world. Show it to us. Or we might never see it.

Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2017, 13:51:37 »
Well, Nikon's survival is not obvious if instead of improving products, new models have important features removed. It can lead to a situation where the used market product is seen by some users as preferable to the new model.

Nikon should go over their minds to improve each model instead of making it better in some respect and less in others. In this case they risk people going after D7200's on the used market instead of new D7500's. For example if someone wants wifi that actually works, they would likely go for the older model, if they have manual focus lenses without chips, or if they want the safety of dual card writing. I believe the D7200 has been a very successful product for Nikon. Why risk that customer satisfaction by removing important features on the new model? When Nikon included CPU metering support to the D200 and vastly improved the viewfinder, this to me was a show of support from the company that mid-level body should be compatible with manual focus lenses (and give a clear viewfinder image so that focus could be evaluated by eye, to some extent). Now they are taking a step back. Who is not to guarantee that next time around they won't remove these features from the D500's or D750's successor also? I think it's important for Nikon to understand that there are legacy lens users and it's very disappointing that affordable camera bodies now give poor support to their use.

Just yesterday I was thinking about buying a DX camera and it seems likely now that I would go for the old model instead of the new one because replacing some of my non-CPU lenses would be costly and I had trusted that Nikon would keep the current level of support. D500 viewfinder is kind of tight with my glasses and I would not be completely happy with that model because of that reason, although otherwise the viewfinder is excellent. I need to re-evaluate the viewfinders in a shop to see what the situation is. The D7200 eyepoint is 19.5mm, the D7500 18.5mm and D500 16mm.  I know this doesn't tell the whole story (there can be differences in how recessed the viewfinder ocular is and how thick it is) but it's disappointing to me. I miss the F100's and F3HP's good viewfinder ergonomics for eyeglass users. Anyway, it's best to try it out and see how it works in practice.

Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2017, 14:15:33 »
Hmm. They included radio-controlled remote flash support in the D7500. This does make it more appealing to me.

Also, I really like auto AF fine tune; I've used it with the D5 (averaging resulting value from several repetitions) and with every lens except one, the resulting value has been the one that works best in practical use. I know some users say it doesn't work well (I suppose this depends on the lens and test conditions), but it has been very helpful to me. For some reason it didn't give the optimal value for the 105/1.4.

Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2017, 16:08:08 »
The D7500 specifications do suggest center weighted metering and spot are available on non-CPU lenses:

"Metering Method:
Center-weighted: Weight of 75% given to 8 mm circle in center of frame. Diameter of circle can be changed to 6, 10, or 13 mm, or weighting can be based on average of entire frame (non-CPU lenses use 8-mm circle)
Matrix: 3D Color Matrix Metering III (type G, E and D lenses); Color Matrix Metering III (other CPU lenses)
Spot: Meters circle with diameter of about 3.5 mm (about 2.5% of frame) centered on selected focus point (on center focus point when non-CPU lens is used)
Highlight-weighted: Available with type G, E, and D lenses"



Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2017, 16:35:32 »
It appears the positioning support holes and electrical connections for a vertical grip are missing from the D7500 base. Also no vertical grip is mentioned in the accessories section so far.

CS

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2017, 17:25:50 »
This thread is my introduction to the D7500, 10 minutes ago I had no idea that it was coming. Having said that. I have to remark on Ilkka's remarks, which hit home for me.

I have a D200, and for me focusing the 105/2.5 ais has been a problem. So much so, that I don't mount the lens on the D200. As Ilkka said, the F100 and F3HP were easy to focus with that lens. Remarks from other DX users have not extolled the virtues of non-cpu lenses on DX models, and AFAIK, that is a major problem. Nikon's non-cpu F mount lenses should not present focusing issues on any Nikon model, IMO.

Ilkka is right again about folks looking at used models when the hobble a D7200 replacement as they have donw with the D7500. No thanks, not for me. In fact, with the bon-cpu lens focusing issue for DX, I'm just not excited about replacing my D200 with a later DX model. Admittedly, I have not shot with any DX model newer than my D200, so I have no personal experience. OTOH, I'm not likely to get any such experience.

The way things are going with Nikon, I'm probably out of the camera buying market.
Carl

Hugh_3170

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2017, 18:37:43 »
Maybe this is a new form of Nikon's hobbling of cameras that do not have an aperture coupling tab?

I have also read it to mean that spot metering and a basic form of centre weighted metering will be provided to non-cpu equipped lenses in Manual mode only.  I have always wondered why something along these lines could not have been done before now.  Still I too prefer the way the D7200 does its metering with non-cpu lenses.

The D7500 specifications do suggest center weighted metering and spot are available on non-CPU lenses:

"Metering Method:
Center-weighted: Weight of 75% given to 8 mm circle in center of frame. Diameter of circle can be changed to 6, 10, or 13 mm, or weighting can be based on average of entire frame (non-CPU lenses use 8-mm circle)
Matrix: 3D Color Matrix Metering III (type G, E and D lenses); Color Matrix Metering III (other CPU lenses)
Spot: Meters circle with diameter of about 3.5 mm (about 2.5% of frame) centered on selected focus point (on center focus point when non-CPU lens is used)
Highlight-weighted: Available with type G, E, and D lenses"

Hugh Gunn

Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2017, 19:27:02 »
Maybe in the future Nikon will add stop down metering of manual lenses to D5600 successor as well; there should not be any hardware reason not to. I am trying to see a silver lining.  :)

It has been expected that cameras and lenses become more expensive in the future because of reduced sales volume. Nikon is just saying that they want D500 money for dual card slot and full Ai metering functionality now.

I wonder why Nikon dropped the 24MP sensor; is it to gain fps or to share costs, or improve high ISO or colour consistency? I wonder if they give up on higher pixel densitities entirely or if they will revisit this in the future. It is a little ironic that the models with the best AF are not the models with the highest resolution now in either DX or FX.

MILLIREHM

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2017, 19:51:29 »
disappointing
Nikon should bring products with fascinating "esprit", not nitpicking lineup changes
thats not the way for the proposed higher quality path for making more revenue
Wolfgang Rehm

Ilkka Nissilš

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Re: D7500 - Nikon gives and Nikon takes
« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2017, 20:20:12 »
Nikon is not focusing on increasing revenue any more (as this is not likely possible in a declining market) rather their focus is on profitability. By removing expensive mechanical parts they can reduce manufacturing cost (and since the camera price is increased a bit, greater profit).  If some previous D7x00 users now feel the need to buy the D500 instead of D7500 to get those features, Nikon also ends up with greater profit (which may or may not be above zero now).

On the other hand, the cost of some features such as high fps and large buffer are going down. 8fps with 50 raw image burst depth has not been available at the D7500 price level in a DSLR before.