DIY Tripod Modification.

[John G]

How this idea was born was through having worked with a Liquid Rubber Roofing Compound brand name "Enkopur".
The construction project had a delay due to lack of certain materials, this allowed for a period of boredom or creativity, I chose the latter. 
I had a notion that if the Liquid Rubber did not get any air contact it would not cure as it is a one part product not in need of a activator to set of curing.
I then thought that this could be used as a liquid damper, if it were in a airtight compartment.
After a few, Hmm, Hmmm, Hmm, sessions, it clicked, I moved on from a Hi Fi application and brought it into my photography realm.
My first thoughts with out any thought on how it would allow functionality, would be to paint a Alumnium Tripod with it, giving a external rubber coating that when cured would be a possible damping for tube resonances. This was abandoned as a task as I soon worked out the
Tripod would end up with function restrictions due to the external coating.
It was more important for me to attempt to keep the Compound in a Permanent Liquid State.
Then the idea came about of stripping the tripod down and filling the tubes with the Liquid Rubber.
The method evolved of how to achieve the task. It was a case of placing a tight fitting foam plug in the tube bottoms to support a Silicon Sealant. The Foam Plug and applied Silicon Sealant were to set in at a depth so that the items to be re-attached were not to be obstructed by the Silicon Seal. The seals were at each stage given 24 - 48 hours to achieve a good cure.
When a bottom seal was cured the Liquid Rubber was poured into the tubes via a funnel to a predetermined fill level. Then the foam and Silicon Sealant was applied to the top of the tube to make a airtight compartment. On the tripod I used there were three tubular section for each leg so a total of nine Liquid rubber sealed tubes.
The Feet, Leg Slide Control and Top Plate Connectors had to be reattached to the tubes. The void left in each tube where these components were to inserted or clamped were filled with Silicon Sealant and the components were submerged into the fresh silicon, this is a little messy and a little soapy water applied to the silicon sealant will assist in cleaning the over spilled residuals of the silicon sealant. Any silicon on the bolt threads of the reattached parts is best cleaned after the nut is fixed as it will be a very secure nut with the silicon bonding it to the thread.
The Cast Top Plate was reattached and the trials began.
A standard set of engineers tripod legs were set up along side our modified damped legs. A lake with wildfowl was in the distance, a engineers level was mounted on both tripods and the focus was on the birds. The legs were tapped with a metal bar, to create a vibration,
the out come was night and day, the damped legs were exceptional, the focus on the birds was almost unaffected in relation to lens shake.
On close in static subjects, the damped tripod was a even better success.
On a later date there were high winds gusting to more than 50MPH, this was known as the crane operations were stopped due to wind speeds. We took both tripods to a exposed to the wind area and set them up. All I can say is you feared for the standard tripod in the wind,
it wanted to go over, no such concerns with the damped tripod due to the added weight, as for lens shake issues it was doing great again.

Stage Two,
A precast top plate may be a good platform for a engineers level weight about 1- 1.5 Kg. For Long Telephotos, this plate modified to work would still be a concern and a detractor from the enjoyment of using the tripod.
I purchased a 120mm x 120mm x 30mm Aluminium plate to be machined into a new top plate.
I also purchased a 200mm x 30mm x 30mm Aluminium Bar to be cut to suit and machined into the legs hinge attachment points.
After being let down by a Metal Engineers workshop to carry out the work and a delay of about a year due to this, I have resumed the work in December 2016 as a DIY project. The arrival of the 400mm f2.8G has prompted this. If all goes swimmingly well, l hope to have it functioning in January 2017.
This is not intended to be a travel tripod, it is intended for home use and what I refer to as "out the back of the vehicle usage".
I would think that with it rigged with camera,lens,gimbal, it would, with regular stops when walking, be acceptable to hike a few kilometres as a round trip.
So far due to owning the original tripod/Silicon Sealant/Enkopur and not incurring any machinery charges, I have about £70 outlay in Aluminium, and I expect about another £10 for cosmetic finishing as the Legs are Luminous Yellow at present. 
 
   

[Akira]

John, it sounds like an interesting project.  Can you fold the tripod legs after the treatment?

A member of a flickr group I know uses a heavy and sturdy tripod for an auto level bought on ebay at a very reasonable price for his tele lens work.  I thought it was a good idea for the "back of the vehicle" usage, too.

[Bjørn Rørslett]

I once made a tripod dedicated to underwater use by filling its legs with molten lead. Worked, but immensely impractical and the danger of pinching one's fingers was huge.

Later I understood the best tripods for long lenses should not be heavy, but torsionally rigid. A heavy weight, literally, was lifted off my shoulders.

[Erik Lund]

Sounds like quite a big project!

I also note that tis would make collapsing the legs impossible, and very heavy,,, or am I missing something.

I will just add that carbon fibre is the material to rely on for portable tripods. Expensive but nice,,,

[John G]

Hi Eric, Akira.
          The initial idea for this was to give it to a family member who was using a Canon 800mm MF Lens.
          Here is a image of the Tripod I have chose to modify, they are very common in construction and civil engineering and can be found
at very inexpensive price in a used condition. I have chose this image as the yellow attachments are easily identifiable, that are removed to
leave the tube naked. If you push the foam plug about 120mm into each tube where the feet enter and and at about 80mm into the tube at the locations where the leg slide control and top plate connector are attached. This depth will allow for a 20mm silicon sealant plug. Best to check these measures against any tripod model chosen.
As for weight I would guess the total added weight to the standard tripod due to the liquid rubber is about 2kg.
All I can say about it is, it functions exactly as the original tripod, but a heavier to manage model, the performance test was very good as to lens shake being induced by external forces, when used with a engineers levelling optic. It was very well damped.
I am a firm believer in modern materials and their efficiency at delivering results, these come at a considerable cost and will have to wait for a while. A Sirui R5214XL is a very desirable future purchase option. At present the £100 Maximum spent on this tripod, to offer my 400mm a very stable base, will be a interesting project and achievement.

[Erik Lund]

Point is why not use the same or similar amount of economical attention to the support as to the lens,,,


Didn't know it wasn't for the 400 f/2.8,,, Good luck with the project.

[John G]

The project was born from looking to create a " out the back of a vehicle tripod" to support a Canon 800mm for a family member.
The Canon owner migrated to a all Nikon system in Easter 2016. A Gitzo Tripod and Jobu Gimbal was purchased shortly after to support a Nikon 600mm f4.
The need to finish the DIY tripod was now a low priority.
I purchased a 400mm early in December and after a few plays with it, realised I needed a substantial support to get the best, my carbon fibre tripod does not feel adequate.
I brought the DIY tripod system out of storage,it should function as a project that will work as a stop gap, until a viable carbon fibre model is afforded.
At present the Sirui R5124XL has my attention, for a purchase in 2017. It is the best part of a 1000 euros, so will need to be budgeted for. 

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Many uses of long lenses are troubled by an inadequate tripod head. Having a heavy tripod is little helpful on its own.

What kind of head that is optimal depends on the intended subject. Personally I tend to use fluid heads.

[PedroS]

Interesting project but if you go that direction then a sturdy Berlebach, like the Frank Bagyi edition could give you better results.
Bjorn made a fairly important point, it's not the weight it's the torsional rigidity that matters the most... I have learned the hard way...

Ok, you want (need) a great pair of legs  , but Sirui is the same as Rollei with their big one advertising wonders. I tend to pass over those brands (maybe I0m wrong) but at the end of the day I still need a tripod that works, and some of those don't know, even Gitzo doesn't go every time. Never used a Sirui but used some identical brands and from, loose screws, broken legs, carbon splitting (dangerous) I have seen all. Now for my serious tele work I just really on 3 brands: Sachtler, Cartoni and Berlebach. And I must say the Berlebach is a hell of a tripod, pity being heavy and not so tall.

Now the head, again, you now know my opinion about those brands. But remember 3 things: 1st if a head breaks all the gear is making a hard ground contact (and it happens more than expected); durability on long term, again.... and ability to support without transmitting vibration. You have the fluid heads (the best, the heaviest, the more expensive also), but bear in mind the allowed weight support. For a 400mm f2.8 the Sachtler FSB8 is the absolute minimum. The Cartoni focus FD is great, but remember to have a third-party lens foot that brings CG down. The gimbals, we have to talk about gimbals, are very good, but consider brands like Wimberley, Jobu (the big ones), RRS, and the new Kirk. I like a lot the new gimbal from Kirk. It has a new way of supporting the axis and the arms are kept to a minimum length, what it always good.

Now the budget, and tripods and heads follow the well know... quality comes from price!
Some 1000€ for the legs (some good between 500 and 800€, or 500€ for the Bagyi one) and between 1000€ and 2000€ for the head.
Don't go for less, as the 400mm deserves only the best...

[Akira]

John, thanks for the additional details of your project.  The tripod you modified looks exactly like the one for the auto level!

I guess that the extra weight should help to withstand the windy conditions.  Also, I wonder why the tripod for the auto level seems to still be made heavy...

[Matthew Currie]

My experience with surveying style tripods has been that although steady when planted right, they are clumsy to handle and don't plant well if they can't dig into the ground.  It helps a little to put chains on the feet to control spread, but I always found them unwieldy.  In fact, though I don't use one for surveying I do have a transit, and for that I went the other way.  At some point I found very cheaply a "Quickset Samson" tripod, of the sort sometimes used in video, without a head, and adapted that for the transit.  It's much easier to set up on irregular ground where there may be stones or roots, and plenty stable enough.

The Samson has braced legs and much nicer adjustments, and is rated for something like 44 pounds, but I think if you needed to you could stand on it.  With the right head, I would expect it to be about as sturdy as you'd need.

[John G]

Hi Akira
           I am not sure of all the materials used in different models that would contribute to the weight difference between the model you are familiar with and the aluminium tube model I am using. I do know there is a painted wooden version that has more weight than a aluminium model, these are preferred by theodolite users.
Pedro,
         I have checked out the kirk gimbal and like the weight capacity and the extra thought that has gone into the controls. It is worth further investigation. I have not considered the video type tripods, just the usual brand names in telescopic tube tripods. The Sirui has good positive user reviews, it can support 30Kg and has a 10 layer carbon fibre 40mm diameter top tube in 4 sections, the smallest section is 32mm. It can be adjusted to 2 metres in height with out using a centre tube. The "R" models are systematic and can take attachments to support a video set up.     

[Bjørn Rørslett]

Have you used, or seen, Sachtler tripods? Extremely light weight and extremely capable and sturdy units.

[David H. Hartman]

I've found my 7.0kg 15.5 lb. Bogus Bogen video tripod with its stanless steel lower legs is stable in 35 MPH wind if the legs are spread wide, short almost no extension, like a machine gun tripod. The head is a Sinar 2-way head for an 8x10" view camera and locks very solid. The center column is not raised for 180mm lenses and up. I've tested it with a 300/4.5 ED-IF AI which was my longest lens at the time.

I wish I could afford several new tripods from light to heavy duty. I would likely get a couple of Sachtler tripods and I like fluid heads.

Dave Hartman who thinks working out of a truck is great!

[Akira]

John, I think the theodolite is mounted on a very similar tripod as used for the auto level, but this is a minor point here.  Thanks for the details anyway!

Many uses of long lenses are troubled by an inadequate tripod head. Having a heavy tripod is little helpful on its own.

What kind of head that is optimal depends on the intended subject. Personally I tend to use fluid heads.

I'm aware of the importance of the head, but the main topic here is the tripod project.  So, I only refer to the tripod.